Living Soil

BrotherBoris said:
As a vegetarian I like that this compost uses no dead animal products. They will have some rich loose soil with their compost added. My grandmother used kitchen vegetable scraps in her compost and she also threw in egg shells.
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Bro thats sweet but also nonsense to exclude bodily remains in general.

Its part of nature.

If it wasnt the planet was covered in dead bodies.

Also not a fan of the bigtime meat industry, rather eat less but quality, then again we can close the circulation of resources gap by upcycling these waste products into valuable fertilzer.
Fermentation and use of benficial funghi along with classic composting (in which a plethora of concepts happen all together but often take more time) we can really get the best out of it while breaking down some of the lesser wanted things like pathogens and pesticides that may be present.
 
He does use dead chickens and pigeons as activators.

I think he mentions that fish is also an excellent ingredient in compost.

If these activators are not acceptable Comfrey can be used as a supplement/replacement.

One of the good points of living soil and organics is that the only inputs needed are wood chips, leaves, green waste and an activator.

All the other amendments that shops sell can be added to the compost but the question is why spend all that money when the starting ingredients can be had for free?

If worm castings and worm juice/comfrey/compost tea can be used as an addition to this then it can all be free.

It's a closed system where all you have to pay for is the base ingredients that you cannot collect yourself from nature. i.e woodchips

Food scraps from the kitchen feed the wormfarm etc etc.
 
Seen examples with worms in the medium that have been pretty much outstanding.

Best for beds tho.

Worms are definitely stepping the game up!

iu


You'll have to watch th C/N ratio a tille when you use woodchips, they are very C heavy.

For urban areas with not much space for a wormfarm one can utilize a Bokashi system. The runoff from a Bokashi bucket is literally one of the best things ive ever fed to plants.

That said my homemade buckets started leaking at the silicon sealing and are currently out of business.
One can also ferment in a closed container like a glass jar or the likes.

Because of low pH every Bokashi has to be mixed into soil a few weeks prior to use, it will blend in and lose its sharpness.
 
BrotherBoris said:
As a vegetarian I like that this compost uses no dead animal products. They will have some rich loose soil with their compost added. My grandmother used kitchen vegetable scraps in her compost and she also threw in egg shells.
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Oh damn man join the club- I hate all of these recipes for fish/ bone meal, but it is tricky finding alternatives. Not sure if you've tried any of the knf stuff, but there is a recipe for water soluable calcium using egg shells using vinegar and egg shells, and its supposed to be great. My garden seemed to like it at least!

I am wondering for all those haze heads out there, do you find you need to reduce worm castings or anything like that (reducing the N in flowering) with the longer flowering strains?


@Proud Kraut fraid I don't agree with you on this one. For much the same reason you are creating a living soil rather than using bottled nutes, its down to choice. You can create a living soil to be fully vegan, its down to choice.
 
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We all do what we like and what makes sensi (pun intended) to us. I will use vegetable and plant material decomposed or guano if I go organic. All soil originated from decomposed plant matter. But for me now, hydro and soilless will be chemical frets from the labs. It’s just my way and not saying anyone else needs to do the same.

Some of us doodle faces and some of us doodle similar faces…

😉👍🍀
 
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BrotherBoris said:
We all do what we like and what makes sensi (pun intended) to us. I will use vegetable and plant material decomposed or guano if I go organic. All soil originated from decomposed plant matter. But for me now, hydro and soilless will be chemical frets from the labs. It’s just my way and not saying anyone else needs to do the same.

Some of us doodle faces and some of us doodle similar faces…

😉👍🍀
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Amen brother...Boris 😜
 
'I hate all of these recipes for fish/ bone meal, but it is tricky finding alternatives"

If you watched the video on compost @lozac123 you would have noticed that he suggests a way of doing it with Comfrey leaves as the activator.
Even the Comfrey leaves are not essential.
The mix is already activated once you make the pile, wet it and cover it.
The dead chicken is not necessary it just speeds up the process and adds some extra nutrients.

Seaweed would be a good addition also to a compost mix.

The title of the thread says 'living soil' not vegan soil.

In a living soil things are being born and dying all the time.
Dying is part of life.
 
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@lozac123 and @BrotherBoris of course no one should feel a dogma in the room to do this or that way.

Just in a whole thats a full cycle to me.

But theres also been a prominent approach to vegan nutes by Kyle Kushman with Vegamatrix.

I've never used blood meal or fish meal as single ingredients but all kinds of guanos (bat, seabird...) and organic mixtures that also include animal wasteproducts, single ingredient horn meal etc pp.

Its totally up to ones own creativity to find a personal recipe.
 
what catched my intrest is the idea of a friend maybe i can make a little review in here if he goes on with it.
What you do with our used pots? U right away refine the earth with supplements and let it rest for a while?
What you put in ? Compost, Bukashi or ready to use ingredients? U also use garden and or kitchen waste?

His idea was to directly put the used pots after screening out the rock/vulcanic pebbles into such a Wormcasting bag like this:

wurmkiste.at

Wormbag Für Den Hausbesitzer

Der WormBag verwertet täglich bis zu 2kg Biomüll und überzeugt mit seinem einfachen Ernte-System. Kein Umgraben, Hochheben oder Aussortieren der Würmer.
wurmkiste.at wurmkiste.at

What do you think ? Guess its not that dumb. FIrst he meant there is a lot of nutrient in the earth because his plants dont show any heavy defi even in late flowering stage.
Second the complete root system holds a lot of water and nutrient and could broke up fast by the worms and revive the earth instantly.
Third point is you can directly put in your kitchen waste and its quite well mixed up by the worms and i guess its lose some sharpness compared to bokashi or homemade liquid fertilizer.

His plan is to avoid use of fertilizer by often repotting the plants to a bigger pot. Im quite intrested if this works and the kitchen waste of an vegan household are fertile enough to feed the plants in total because it fits in the prior discussion.
 
thaseus92 said:
what catched my intrest is the idea of a friend maybe i can make a little review in here if he goes on with it.
What you do with our used pots? U right away refine the earth with supplements and let it rest for a while?
What you put in ? Compost, Bukashi or ready to use ingredients? U also use garden and or kitchen waste?

His idea was to directly put the used pots after screening out the rock/vulcanic pebbles into such a Wormcasting bag like this:

wurmkiste.at

Wormbag Für Den Hausbesitzer

Der WormBag verwertet täglich bis zu 2kg Biomüll und überzeugt mit seinem einfachen Ernte-System. Kein Umgraben, Hochheben oder Aussortieren der Würmer.
wurmkiste.at wurmkiste.at

What do you think ? Guess its not that dumb. FIrst he meant there is a lot of nutrient in the earth because his plants dont show any heavy defi even in late flowering stage.
Second the complete root system holds a lot of water and nutrient and could broke up fast by the worms and revive the earth instantly.
Third point is you can directly put in your kitchen waste and its quite well mixed up by the worms and i guess its lose some sharpness compared to bokashi or homemade liquid fertilizer.

His plan is to avoid use of fertilizer by often repotting the plants to a bigger pot. Im quite intrested if this works and the kitchen waste of an vegan household are fertile enough to feed the plants in total because it fits in the prior discussion.
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Thats a dope Idea, i Like the wormbag Design! Whats the Deal with Bokashi vs a Wormsfarm is you can do is right in your kitchen also in small urban spaces.
 
Same size as an bokashi bucket i guess:

wurmkiste.at

WURMBOX Kompakter Etagen-Wurmkomposter

Verwandelt Küchenabfälle mit der Wurmbox schnell in nährstoffreiche Erde für deine Pflanzen. Stabil, platzsparend & modular erweiterbar.
wurmkiste.at wurmkiste.at

the point for me is bokashi is quite sharp and not ready to use or? i never used really bukashi made with EM Microbes only self made liquid fertilizer with an bucket containing sieves and charcoal so there can all Micorbes in air settle down and compost everything even coffe filters and so what i hear bukashi also cant do.
And what u all think isnt wormcasting the best medium to start some living soil with as base product? Closest to real Humus what u can make fast at home?
What Im also intrested in is this Chitin containg earth that mushashi uses, never saw something here in Germany except this:

beckhorn.de

Insektendung-Pellets - Beckmann & Brehm

Naturdünger aus nachhaltiger Insektenzucht. Aktiviert das Bodenleben. Geruchsarm. Keine Gefahr durch Unkrautsamen und Keime!
beckhorn.de beckhorn.de

Really want to give this one a try after i figured out how to get it. Also contains Chitin and NPK-3,5+3,5+2,5.

And what u all use for great surface for Microbes in your soil ? I moved from the quite expansive but good Seramis to Lavarocks because they should have even more surface and also add some chunky charcoal a little bit pulverized.
 
thaseus92 said:
Same size as an bokashi bucket i guess:

wurmkiste.at

WURMBOX Kompakter Etagen-Wurmkomposter

Verwandelt Küchenabfälle mit der Wurmbox schnell in nährstoffreiche Erde für deine Pflanzen. Stabil, platzsparend & modular erweiterbar.
wurmkiste.at wurmkiste.at

the point for me is bokashi is quite sharp and not ready to use or? i never used really bukashi made with EM Microbes only self made liquid fertilizer with an bucket containing sieves and charcoal so there can all Micorbes in air settle down and compost everything even coffe filters and so what i hear bukashi also cant do.
And what u all think isnt wormcasting the best medium to start some living soil with as base product? Closest to real Humus what u can make fast at home?
What Im also intrested in is this Chitin containg earth that mushashi uses, never saw something here in Germany except this:

beckhorn.de

Insektendung-Pellets - Beckmann & Brehm

Naturdünger aus nachhaltiger Insektenzucht. Aktiviert das Bodenleben. Geruchsarm. Keine Gefahr durch Unkrautsamen und Keime!
beckhorn.de beckhorn.de

Really want to give this one a try after i figured out how to get it. Also contains Chitin and NPK-3,5+3,5+2,5.

And what u all use for great surface for Microbes in your soil ? I moved from the quite expansive but good Seramis to Lavarocks because they should have even more surface and also add some chunky charcoal a little bit pulverized.
Click to expand...

Doenst the worm bin smell? Looks good but Bokashi will digest some stuff and Break it down different than Worms its a different Game.

A Combination would be sweet, topdress the worm bin with bokashi.

Best to try for yourself! As with anything in life ratlos Matter.
 
as far as i knew 1g active charcoal has the surface of 1 whole football field.
you make your bukashi with EM Microbes or without ProduKraut?

but didnt you think as long as u have the space for even an small composter its the best way to go? There are worms, all kinds of microbes, insects and all together merge this new humus.

I cant help me but in the end i see some big money making with all these fancy living soil ingredents but the most of them can be easily replaced by Biobizz Pre Mix.

Also a lot of Terra Preta gets manufactured in small companys and is buyable ready to use. Thats something like the Chitin thing what i really would try to make a grow to compare the benefit of both.

Will start some small report with my first MN-Seeds the next days most of them popped well except Shark Shock may i hade some bad batch a lot of cripples/leaf deformation.
 
@thaseus92 ive Made my Bokashi batches with liquid EMa from EM1.

Its been a while, my buckets where DIY and startet leaking at the runoff, then i switched to closed Containers and did some EM Fermentation using dedicated fertlizer like those Pellets Mixed with spent charcoal from my Filter.
That stuff ended Up nourishing my small vegetable Garden and Bring life to the soil.

Next Thing to try is Bokashi with LAB Made from raw Milk.

Yes there are a few Options for bagged Terra Preta i havent tried yet but i think they are pretty good and way better suited for growing Weed or anything else than peat mixes.
Also way more sustainable.
 
Never tried Boakashi @Proud Kraut but I have friends that have used it.
They reallly liked the results and the convenience of having it inside.
Compost bins outside can stall a bit over winter.

Any way we choose to recycle our waste and then re-use it is a win for the planet and a win for us.
If you have the space composting will give you the bulk of your base material.
Bokashi or vermicast become the additive.
Not sure if you end up with any liquid doing it the Bokashi way but I am sure it could be soaked and used for fertigation.
You could probably just top dress with it in that case though.

A big advantage of a worm farm is the worm juice that runs out the bottom.
Ready made fertilizer and soil conditioner that just needs to be diluted to make a worm tea.
 
Uncle Jack said:
Never tried Boakashi @Proud Kraut but I have friends that have used it.
They reallly liked the results and the convenience of having it inside.
Compost bins outside can stall a bit over winter.

Any way we choose to recycle our waste and then re-use it is a win for the planet and a win for us.
If you have the space composting will give you the bulk of your base material.
Bokashi or vermicast become the additive.
Not sure if you end up with any liquid doing it the Bokashi way but I am sure it could be soaked and used for fertigation.
You could probably just top dress with it in that case though.

A big advantage of a worm farm is the worm juice that runs out the bottom.
Ready made fertilizer and soil conditioner that just needs to be diluted to make a worm tea.
Click to expand...

I think a worm farm and bokashi are pretty close in what the basic concept is.
Breaking stuff down or up cycling it vs rotting.

Both have a crucial Ingredient wether it be the worms or it be a EM / LAB starter culture.

Now both also have a standard range of environmental requests in time space and temperatures where they operate in effectively.

Same with compost but compost draws from what is there, spores in the air, mycel from the ground, needs a CN ratio balance to be effective also.

Advantage of Bokashi: The hermetic principle.

No energy is lost but transformed and refined. Juice can be watered in but use low doses like 50ml on 10l for example to start with. Every bokashi differs naturally from the ingredients and cycle of life.

So all energy potentials in a Bokashi system stay there until you decide to harvest them.

The classic style is like making super soil, add your Bokashi to soil after +-4weeks of fermentation process and then let it sit and cook for a few weeks, mix again, harmonized. But this time it's opposite of cooking, it's more like cooling the hot mix down, let it sink into the medium.

Or topdress and water in, or spike. Depends on inputs, goal and of course if finer material grade is used or if it is in ruff chunks. For indoor pots or beds you need finer grades, outdoor there are more helper breaking it down so chunks are okay.

That's my perspective on it so far.
 
@Proud Kraut can you explain LAB? you mean Lab like the goat or sheep stomach enzym that u use for cheese making?
if so im quite intrested where u get that idea from. got some vegan lab at home from some vegan cheese and tempeh trials and if i may could use it as fermentation booster i would give it a try.

Thanks also for that good explenation sounds like bukashi is worth to give it a try. Already thought about replacing vinegar cleaner at home with some more sustainable cleaner and saw u can easily make EM in bigger amounts at home and when there is a second use i try it for sure.
Can you give any adivce for that too or did u used ready to use EM?

Also got an Link from an old growing fellow from some unbelievable expensive dry fertilizer that he sells a lot in his growshop to younger people with the advice to check the ingredients.... Have to say not bad even more and mostly the same as my father told me...

Using plant-based substances from food, luxury or feed production, algae, leonardite, animal by-products (Cat. 3, Regulation (EC) 1069/2009: fish meal, blood meal, meat bone meal), 6% bat guano, carbonated magnesium lime, carbonated lime Sea algae, epsomite, rock dust (basalt/diabase rock), clay minerals, palm ash, fungi (Trichoderma, mycorrhiza) and bacteria.

Have to say a quite good mix for 1 single fertilizer and also the adivce to water it and let it rest at least 2-4 weeks before using. But the price is not from this planet.... (9,26 € / 1 L) !!!

They also sell quite much of this hyped "living soil" earth pre mix... check out the ingredients: Raised bog peat (H3-H6), coconut fiber, FLO (fertilizer mentioned above), vermicompost, biochar. And the price is no joke.... (66,32 € for 50l)
I mean honestly what happend with this living soil hype that u can easily sell people mostly peat thats the greatest enviormental crime at all for this price...
And what would you all say to peat as base ingredient for living soil ? Doesnt sounds smart to me...
Germans can check it out in native language:
https://www.florganics.de/shop/
 
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