The origins of Haze

  • Thread starter Thread starter JessE
  • Start date Start date
Ok Coop,
there you go,
now you are saying something believable,
very good.

I can believe october indica dominant maine.

The haze I was referring to was also an indica dom, and 25% haze.

Now you are finally starting to make some sense.
Hats off.
 
and while we r at crosses, theoretically there could be also a mostly nl pheno in nh, like there are skunk or nl phenotypes to be found in ssh which are 8,9 weeks fast, chances r small tho ...

again nothing is impossible :D

cmon guys, dont fight ... i got many problems for every solution :D
 
if you flowered a Nevil's Haze for 2 weeks indoors it still has not shown sex at 2 weeks,then you move it outdoors into a 12/12 photoperiod?...
what day in NYC is the first day with 12 hours darkness...?
your idea is weak.
The plant will stall or even rejuvenate if the photoperiod is higher than what it was indoors...
I think it best that anyone who believes that a Haze can finish outdoors in NYC should "Show Me"

peace
scorpion

Well im speculating of coarse.

I would think though that someone could go 10/14 or 12/12 from seed.

Let's assume someone has no room for a NH indoors

Start it indoors, Let it grow, top it, tie it down if that works or is necessary, use root restriction from the beginning. Continue flowering indoors as long as you can, and once it's too big for indoor, or too big to transport without getting noticed ... Take it and transplant outside. One could theoretically keep under a flower regimen from seed indoors for 4-5 weeks if topped and done right

Have you grown out that many NH to say that they all revert back from flowering to veg if given less than 12 hours dark. Ive seen a NL that flowered in 9 1/2 dark.

This is ridiculous in my opinion, and i know I'm a nobody with few posts ... Nonetheless, BH you don't have to deal with this man. NH is limber it can be trained or bent, or leaned over on a transport from indoors to wherever outdoors.

By the way so everyone knows, im not confused about BH being able to pull this off so I'm not going to dwell on it. That's your business. I'm actually not that concerned with what BH says he does or doesn't do. If it applies to me then yeah absolutely, if not then not. Others seem fascinated.

Scorpion I've been following you for months bro, im simply replying in a friendly manner, im actually a big fan of yours. I've got nothing but respect for you all. And again I'm speculating but I feel it's actually silly because if you do think about it, it is possible.

If anyone disagrees, that's fine, hey I absolutely could be wrong as the closest thing I saw to NH personally was a crummy GHS rendition.

Cheers all
 
r212218_816670.jpg
[/IMG]

LoL too funny.

I personally love BH and think he probably did pull it off. But this is hilarious, I'm sure even BH had a good chuckle haha

Good stuff Hempy :) ill still think everyone's giving him a hard time over nothing though. Im no expert though but I really think it's possible. Whatever the case, ill let this thread get back on track

Cheers again all ... And scorpion i have no idea when it gets 12/12 in NY again I'm just speculating but even in my rough speculation it seems quite doable as long as certain parameters are met.

Also I don't know BH exact setup or method, I was just commenting that I believe someone could pull it off if well thought out and planned ... I bet leet could, I bet scorpion or hempy could and British hemp if you guys put your mind to it,

I've seen some of the stuff you guys grow . .. Absolutely AMAZING, I get drool on my keyboard every time lol. I know you guys could do it. L33t would ace hay sh!t.

Again, just me speculating so please don't quote me to hard. I'm insignificant anyway :)

Anyway back to the thread. Everybody enjoy your day/evening

Peace
 
Well im speculating of coarse.

I would think though that someone could go 10/14 or 12/12 from seed.

Let's assume someone has no room for a NH indoors

Start it indoors, Let it grow, top it, tie it down if that works or is necessary, use root restriction from the beginning. Continue flowering indoors as long as you can, and once it's too big for indoor, or too big to transport without getting noticed ... Take it and transplant outside. One could theoretically keep under a flower regimen from seed indoors for 4-5 weeks if topped and done right

Have you grown out that many NH to say that they all revert back from flowering to veg if given less than 12 hours dark. Ive seen a NL that flowered in 9 1/2 dark.

This is ridiculous in my opinion, and i know I'm a nobody with few posts ... Nonetheless, BH you don't have to deal with this man. NH is limber it can be trained or bent, or leaned over on a transport from indoors to wherever outdoors.

By the way so everyone knows, im not confused about BH being able to pull this off so I'm not going to dwell on it. That's your business. I'm actually not that concerned with what BH says he does or doesn't do. If it applies to me then yeah absolutely, if not then not. Others seem fascinated.

Scorpion I've been following you for months bro, im simply replying in a friendly manner, im actually a big fan of yours. I've got nothing but respect for you all. And again I'm speculating but I feel it's actually silly because if you do think about it, it is possible.

If anyone disagrees, that's fine, hey I absolutely could be wrong as the closest thing I saw to NH personally was a crummy GHS rendition.

Cheers all
hey puday,no offence meant.
if I wanted to do a NH I would grow it in a small planter {small enough to carry} outdoors until it got too cold and finish it indoors...the results will be better than the other way around.
simply because Nevil's wont finish outdoors outside of the tropics,
as per the breeders grow instructions,this prevents folks from making a costly and embarrasing error...it will grow great,
but the flowers if any will be bland and very immature.
Lets assume someone has not the room for NH indoors...well simple,grow something faster.
you dont need alot of room,if you are a thinker.
try horizontal instead of vertical.
one 12 ft long haze grown indoors coiled around the closet wall only 4ft high at its highest point...yield...over a lb. 600-1000watts
exhaust ventilation is a very important aspect to indoor growing and I think is easily over looked for more High Tech adventures.
You seem to be very eager and for real and I thank you for the cordial post.
try not to take my printed words too personal,I just cannot seem to type the way I actually communicate with my friends,I'm usually very quiet and let others do the talking.

peace
scorpion
 
The Nh showed sex about the 20th of july ,started flowering the beinning of september .i chopped Nov 11th soo you can say she flowered around 10 weeks maybe abit longer.i could and would have left her out if no rain was ahead .

i thought other factors such as cold and being in a pot could help finish earlier true or not ?
Hi Bigherb,
I hope you are doing well out there in cyber land, though I have to tell you that we do not see eye to eye on this subject. I would love to tell all of you that I am growing Nevilles Haze, Mango Haze and Super Silver Haze exclusively outside (not far from bigherb) and that I have no reason for my other lines anymore. However, based off personal experience on this subject, I have to tell you growing these lines outside, especially the MH and NH, just are not going to happen without a green house in the general approximate area of 40 N.

For those interested, they can check out my efforts (two seasons worth) of growing 50% haze hybrids, the first season MNS F1 Super Silver Haze and Mango Haze and the 2nd season MNS F1 Mango Haze and my own hybrids from the previous season's grow. Both seasons required a green house to get the plants anywhere near acceptable harvest windows, without the green house, and the enormous risk that came from such an under taking, things would not have worked out in my favor in the harvest department.

http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/mango-haze/1079-mns-mango-haze.html

There may be good reason why BH has elected not to share pictures with the community, so we only really have his word to go on things. With a little research find that around early November Bigherb mentioned to Gertlush, who had just recently posted a picture of his Nevilles Haze plants, that herb's Nevilles Haze was around the same stage of flower.

Figure 1
Originally posted by Bigherb (11-03-2009)
gert

ur nevs is beautiful

did you take her in yet ?

ive got a nevs lookin alot like yours id say bout same stage as pics

im thinkin in might be time to chop nite time is hittin mid 40's

1luvbigherb
http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/35326-post266.html

So by judging bigherbs words from that period, we see that his plants are in a similar stage to Gert Lushes. See Figure 2.

Figure 2
http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/34411-post265.html

From this thread:
http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/nevilles-haze/775-mr-nice-nevilleshaze-27.html#post34411


As we see above, Bigherb has posted that he harvested it Nov 11th. And on the 3rd of Nov, by point of reference, we can see herb believes his Nevilles Haze is around the same stage as Gerts. Gert himself believes his plant has quite a ways to go, so I believe its safe to say we can lay this issue to rest once and for all. It does not appear that your plants were anywhere near ready to me, based off the posts from the period in question. This is not an attack or anything else bigherb, but rather an attempt to understand your position and looking back into the past in an effort to understand your present day position. Your plants may have been in the early stages of flower, but they had quite a ways to go still.

When I was attempting to do the MNS F1 Mango Haze and Super Silver Haze, both 50% haze hybrids, I knew what I was getting into based off prior experiences with the beta Mango Haze. As such, I was prepared to build a green house from scratch in order to bring the plants in. A very risky maneuver, but a necessary one if I wished to harvest anything of acceptable quality. It worked well for me, but is something I would not want to do every season based off the various problems which ultimately present itself when doing so.

MNS F1 Neville's Haze is a 75% Haze variety, as such it would require similar effort and in many cases a longer flowering period to come into any acceptable stage of flowering. This is difficult to do, to say the least, anywhere near 40 N on the East Coast of the United States without taking alternate steps.
 
Josh

Im not gonna carry on with you you might have to go on that list i made .I'll just say afew words.Its seems you joined the train of take shots at herb at any chance. your knowledge of haze is history is miniscule remeber you were grwoning Ohaze sold bt nevil wen you came here .
You are a lame with weak crosses n selections,sad you were around all that time an have some weak lookin hazes .Oakland haze :eek:.You try to look like you know what you tlking about in many threads when you should really be listening ,soo think b4 you tlk/type


Your definetly on that train now that is a $$$$$$ comment about me dissing nevs hazes ,he was honest enoough to share his opinion read the many/several referenced post.I have shared my opinion ,that mns haze is the closest thing to NYC hazes ive smoked that is the most respect i can personally give .Soo try making sense .Still you cant get threw that peanut ,Tom hill has pure haze .Nevil has posted that haze shines in hybrids an is best for breeding ,Thus you hav a large percent of undesriable pheno's ni THH line.But some mind blowing acid like

i always tell the truth brother ,All i did was share my experience .I said Nevilles haze could have used a week or soo .But she looked great 90% pistils done .Sk/hz No issue at all n this was chopped the last day of october if needed could hav stayed another week or 2 .Im just repeating myself .Im done really ,I said i only popped one seed of nevilles the first year and thought ahh if nothin comes of it i wasted a seed ,i had succes n did it a second year .

It's funny caz IC awhile bac was a madhouse with drama at times ,I neva once have gotten a words of my haze grow being BS n there are more expert's there than here ,Much respect to the mns fam an those i highly respect.


I received one reply in my smoke report here ,I have recieved more feedback and thanks at Ic


There are a few members here who have seen pics ,if they wish to comment soo be it .



1luvbigherb
 
and while we r at crosses, theoretically there could be also a mostly nl pheno in nh, like there are skunk or nl phenotypes to be found in ssh which are 8,9 weeks fast, chances r small tho ...

again nothing is impossible :D

Nev said you sometimes got 10 week NL phenos from NH.

This thread gets funnier and funnier, bigherb is almost as bad as yummybud and I can't believe people are even entertaining him.
 
Hi Bigherb,
I hope you are doing well out there in cyber land, though I have to tell you that we do not see eye to eye on this subject. I would love to tell all of you that I am growing Nevilles Haze, Mango Haze and Super Silver Haze exclusively outside (not far from bigherb) and that I have no reason for my other lines anymore. However, based off personal experience on this subject, I have to tell you growing these lines outside, especially the MH and NH, just are not going to happen without a green house in the general approximate area of 40 N.

For those interested, they can check out my efforts (two seasons worth) of growing 50% haze hybrids, the first season MNS F1 Super Silver Haze and Mango Haze and the 2nd season MNS F1 Mango Haze and my own hybrids from the previous season's grow. Both seasons required a green house to get the plants anywhere near acceptable harvest windows, without the green house, and the enormous risk that came from such an under taking, things would not have worked out in my favor in the harvest department.

http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/mango-haze/1079-mns-mango-haze.html

There may be good reason why BH has elected not to share pictures with the community, so we only really have his word to go on things. With a little research find that around early November Bigherb mentioned to Gertlush, who had just recently posted a picture of his Nevilles Haze plants, that herb's Nevilles Haze was around the same stage of flower.

Figure 1

http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/35326-post266.html

So by judging bigherbs words from that period, we see that his plants are in a similar stage to Gert Lushes. See Figure 2.

Figure 2
http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/34411-post265.html

From this thread:
http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/nevilles-haze/775-mr-nice-nevilleshaze-27.html#post34411


As we see above, Bigherb has posted that he harvested it Nov 11th. And on the 3rd of Nov, by point of reference, we can see herb believes his Nevilles Haze is around the same stage as Gerts. Gert himself believes his plant has quite a ways to go, so I believe its safe to say we can lay this issue to rest once and for all. It does not appear that your plants were anywhere near ready to me, based off the posts from the period in question. This is not an attack or anything else bigherb, but rather an attempt to understand your position and looking back into the past in an effort to understand your present day position. Your plants may have been in the early stages of flower, but they had quite a ways to go still.

When I was attempting to do the MNS F1 Mango Haze and Super Silver Haze, both 50% haze hybrids, I knew what I was getting into based off prior experiences with the beta Mango Haze. As such, I was prepared to build a green house from scratch in order to bring the plants in. A very risky maneuver, but a necessary one if I wished to harvest anything of acceptable quality. It worked well for me, but is something I would not want to do every season based off the various problems which ultimately present itself when doing so.

MNS F1 Neville's Haze is a 75% Haze variety, as such it would require similar effort and in many cases a longer flowering period to come into any acceptable stage of flowering. This is difficult to do, to say the least, anywhere near 40 N on the East Coast of the United States without taking alternate steps.

Jesse

No disrspect .i really said all i can say though,sooo i rather not repeat myself,i just might add let me give myself soe light if any of the nay sayers may see it ,It starts at post #1138 go too the link type 1luvbigherb in (search this thread) you'll see my updates threw out last years grow .3 plants ,remember i havnt spoke of 100's or dozens i nmy years .

Reservation Labs gear grows: - Page 76 - International Cannagraphic Magazine Forums

LMAO


We havnt always seen eye to eye,but you have been polite about our disagreements ,you dont always listen to my point's or answer my questions .But you dont name call n act crazy ,so lets agree to disagree.



Come on brother your smarter than that ,ill post the link too the thread.WHY would i ask gert if he is has took her in yet The plant on that just started flowering LOL

I was referring to the the pics in post #264 FACTUAL caz i say pics ,he only has one post of his haze plant that just started flowering n a lilpic of NEPjam .

http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/nevilles-haze/775-mr-nice-nevilleshaze-27.html#post34411



Believe it or not But that was a weak persausion post


1luvbigherb
 
now's the time for a haze shot in the snow bigherb ;)

now can we try to keep this back on track, and work on a northern haze?

Big up big up

Say Cheese or Frankies :D

Im takin a pic on my sled


A Northern haze with no northern lights i got you


1luvbigherb
 
Originally Posted by JessE
Hi Bigherb,
I hope you are doing well out there in cyber land, though I have to tell you that we do not see eye to eye on this subject. I would love to tell all of you that I am growing Nevilles Haze, Mango Haze and Super Silver Haze exclusively outside (not far from bigherb) and that I have no reason for my other lines anymore. However, based off personal experience on this subject, I have to tell you growing these lines outside, especially the MH and NH, just are not going to happen without a green house in the general approximate area of 40 N.

Hi all,
With growing the MNS F1 Mango Haze and Super Silver Haze outdoors on the East Coast of the United States, at approximately 40 degree's North, and later having to move the plants into a green house to finish out the remainder of their season(s) respectively, a great deal of work went into getting them to an acceptable harvest window. There were some bumps along the way, and ultimately I learned a great deal. Through both success and failure.

For those interested in haze hybrids that may have a chance on the East Coast of the United States, I would recommend something with less than 50% haze in its make up. I honestly watched with great interest as our own BobbyDigital grew the Early Haze a couple of seasons back and found what I would call great success with a line which was grown in the eastern portion of the United States.

http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/early-haze/2121-early-haze-outdoors-9.html

I would wager there are some very nice phenotypes to be found within the Early Haze line based off Bobby's initial grow, an excellent one if I do say so myself, and is likely a great choice for anyone who wants to attempt a haze line outdoors but does not have a green house or a suitable part of the world to grow more sativa dominant lines. Bobby's thread really impressed me and is a credit to Shanti's genius imo.
 
Josh

Im not gonna carry on with you you might have to go on that list i made .I'll just say afew words.Its seems you joined the train of take shots at herb at any chance. your knowledge of haze is history is miniscule remeber you were grwoning Ohaze sold bt nevil wen you came here .
You are a lame with weak crosses n selections,sad you were around all that time an have some weak lookin hazes .Oakland haze :eek:.You try to look like you know what you tlking about in many threads when you should really be listening ,soo think b4 you tlk/type


Your definetly on that train now that is a $$$$$$ comment about me dissing nevs hazes ,he was honest enoough to share his opinion read the many/several referenced post.I have shared my opinion ,that mns haze is the closest thing to NYC hazes ive smoked that is the most respect i can personally give .Soo try making sense .Still you cant get threw that peanut ,Tom hill has pure haze .Nevil has posted that haze shines in hybrids an is best for breeding ,Thus you hav a large percent of undesriable pheno's ni THH line.But some mind blowing acid like

i always tell the truth brother ,All i did was share my experience .I said Nevilles haze could have used a week or soo .But she looked great 90% pistils done .Sk/hz No issue at all n this was chopped the last day of october if needed could hav stayed another week or 2 .Im just repeating myself .Im done really ,I said i only popped one seed of nevilles the first year and thought ahh if nothin comes of it i wasted a seed ,i had succes n did it a second year .

It's funny caz IC awhile bac was a madhouse with drama at times ,I neva once have gotten a words of my haze grow being BS n there are more expert's there than here ,Much respect to the mns fam an those i highly respect.


I received one reply in my smoke report here ,I have recieved more feedback and thanks at Ic


There are a few members here who have seen pics ,if they wish to comment soo be it .



1luvbigherb

You know dude you are a sad little troll. Why you insulting folks on their own thread? I am not surprised that you think my hazes are weak. Because you think THH is the "Original" haze. Look what Tom says about his hazes.


You bought that shit hook line and sinker, little peep. Now you are running around calling everybody names insulting folks, and I'm just saying I know your game. Its all figured out, and you ain't straight bro. Not about growing haze in a snow storm, not about THH being the "Original Haze", not about anything. What is your scene dude? Why don't you get a life and stop running around telling lies like a high school girl?


Do you really think haze brothers haze was 95% "Hay"?
I doubt the Haze brothers would have taken kindly to someone saying that about their haze.

Tom Hill Haze is supposed to come from 95/96 Posi stock to be more precise.
I use to hang a lot at Posi exactly during those days as can attest the catalog of 96 that I posted previously.
I never saw Original Haze seeds for sale there, only their Haze and Purple Haze.
I could ask questions to Tom to be assured that he really bought his Haze there.
For that I would need to have Tom online here.
Anyways when I look at the photos of his Haze I can clearly see that it is not 100% Haze.

Peace.

K.

TomHilHaze.png


Source: http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/3-daily-news/5599-marcos-apology-3.html





Bigherb, you are the one who doesn't know history regarding Haze. Tom Hill got his haze from Positronics 7 years after Seedbank released its first haze hybrid, that is history little puke.

That is at least five years after I got my haze.


My shit is Seedbank. I ain't got any Positronics. You wish you had some joke that was 14 generations removed from a posi joke bred by a guy who thought Haze was Hay. You are so far beyond weak, it brings new meaning to the word pathetic. Why don't go spread your lies and insults someplace else.
 
I guess i could save some arguement with the different hazes to some degree,
a side by side would show any comparisons ..
Imho theres many undesirable types in extreme sativas , but some of it could be put down to growing environment , perhaps in the right environment/climate , the 95% hay would be considered pretty good erb , and the 5% may be considered absolutely elite ...
Id be more than happy to try and obtain some of each for a side by side grow..
It would hopefully save any further disrepectful posting between fellow members ...
 
That would be good Wally, would give us some more reliable direct info and experience with the strain.

I can only speak for myself but I think josh and others feel the same, we're just being disrespectful because we've had a bellyful of lies out of this guy for years now and it has got really annoying and tiresome the way you can't type the word Haze into a thread without bigherb showing up and filling the thread with endless made up musings about something he has never seen nor grown. For me, I've been sick of the dude for 2 years or more, he used to send me several PMs a day at icmag interrogating me, ignoring him didn't stop him, in the end an insult did. Shame it didn't stop him going over and over the same tired worn out questions that there are no believable answers to in public for a couple more years.

How many people on this forum are respected and trusted enough that if they made an outlandish claim that didn't ring true people wouldn't demand evidence and would just swallow it hook, line sinker etc? Maybe Nev and Shanti but even then folks would at least ask to see some proof if possible. So why is bigherb not held to these same standards? The amount of words that flow out of him is frequently overwhelming but they carry zero weight because the guy has done not one single thing to develop any credibility.

It went beyond the point where bigherb needed to put up or stfu about two years ago quite frankly. I know I'm not the only one who thinks this.

Wally, if you have a hankering for running Sam's Haze (Seedsman's, they bought bulk stock from Sam few years back) next to Tom's Haze I happen to know where in Australia you can find a pack of each an I'm sure the fellas who have em have more interesting things they need to be growing right now so they will no doubt be happy to pass em your way. If your interest is piqued I can put you in touch with em then we can see what's what. Maybe someone has some OT1 Haze beans they would contribute for the sake of thoroughness in exploring the remaining shreds of pure Haze.
 
Hi bh ,, yes id be all for it , i d have no problems setting aside a few rows for haze , be a fun project ...
I have no bias with any of it , and would judge them on their merits as i saw them , pics of course and diary and perhaps samples to an independant person to be sure ...
yep that d be a bunch of fun ...
 
Lol....I did this yesterday under the Most Amazing Haze thread at IC
Nev thinks it is a great idea:D

Originally Posted by TomHill
Hello,

In reading the OP's description (NYC Haze etc), he -like Bigherb et al- seems to be looking for something he's much more likely to find in Mr. Nice's line-up. He just needs to look a bit deeper it sounds. As Clarke hinted to in the article "Origins of the Species", this indeed seems to be more the line the Dutch ran with -

"Original Haze varies in taste from citrus Thai notes through the gamut of sativa highlights to the deep spicy purple Colombian flavor most common in Dutch Haze cultivars." (Origins of the Species | Cannabis Culture Magazine)

If I was to make an honest guess (while not in the middle of defending my honor, lol) I'd say that Sam likely gave Nev some of the older Mexican/Colombian seed and this would help to explain the difference between what I work with (more the Thai citrus notes) and what Shanti works with (more the deep spicy purple Colombian).

There are other differences between the two lines as well. For one, it seems Shanti's line goes much longer, throwing 20 week phenotypes even after hybridized with Northern Lights. This, among other things has left an opening for all kinds of yahoos to call into question my integrity and claims that my line has not been outcrossed, or was ever even what I claimed it to be in the first place.

The fact of the matter is that I could have just carbon copied one of Sam's earliest descriptions of "Original Haze" (http://forums.cannabisculture.com/fo...ds//102446.jpg) and used it to describe the line I work with, because it is still very accurate.

Anyway, the line I work with (and Positronic, and Flyingdutchmen, and Seedsman, and everybody else who's ever described/offered "Original Haze", including this early description from Sam), and what Mr. Nice works with, are two different animals - but both good imo.

There is only one person imo who could shed more light, and that is Sam. Regards - Tom


Hi Tom......Well that post has just raised my curiosity. Being a lover of all things Sativa/ Haze, I will do a comparison.
I have with me Shanti's NH which you can see in my current grow, Your Haze, Seedsman original Haze and Nevs F1's.
I could do these over winter and probably will. But I will also do them next summer as I think this will give all a chance to see how much difference there is between them all......sound like a good idea ??
__________________
 
Great minds huh kanga ,, hehe ..
I will also run them in the late winter and spring ,
this will show the ones wanting to finish early vs the ones that reveg when the days are too long for that type ..

I expect some will want to regrow for the longer season , in that area im suspecting your climate will be more favourable than mine unless we get a forgiving wet season and nice end ...

an excellent idea both of us doing the same to see what affects the different climates have on the varieties ..
 
Anyway, the line I work with (and Positronic, and Flyingdutchmen, and Seedsman, and everybody else who's ever described/offered "Original Haze", including this early description from Sam), and what Mr. Nice works with, are two different animals - but both good imo.

havent grown seedsmans version, but all reports and pics i saw were far away from that what i grew from tfd, less sativa, more indica ... if i was about to guess, id bet it has skunk in her, just by the looks of it, and just by the looks of it, its not even intresting to me ... sorry, thats not a haze for my understandings, especially when i think of some 25% haze crosses which were more hazy in those terms ...

also posis and tfd lines are different, seedsmans too

of course you know that when u deal with it for some time ;)
 
Yes mate I would have to agree:D
Going to be very interesting seeing what comes out, especially with Nev being able to test and smell and give a report:D
 
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