Morphote
Well-known member
Sorry I don't mean to interrupt, but...
I'd like 2 kno mo bout this.
Can u plz givus a link?
I'd like 2 kno mo bout this.
Can u plz givus a link?
Hey Fresh,
I posted an outline to the plant patent in the breeding forum; there's a link to the whole patent at the bottom of the thread. Check it out.
I'm going to leave this thread for Jesse.... she seems pretty attached to it emotionally... and really I find it quite a drag to post info here at MNS only to be distracted by JessE's accusations etc.
I've simply got better things to do with my free time than to debate something with someone who isn't informed on the topic, and is just interested in spouting conspiracy theories.
Edit: coop I just saw your post to the same patent on the 12th of April... didn't realize you had posted it already. Nice addition.
-Chimera
I posted an outline to the plant patent in the breeding forum; there's a link to the whole patent at the bottom of the thread. Check it out.
I'm going to leave this thread for Jesse.... she seems pretty attached to it emotionally... and really I find it quite a drag to post info here at MNS only to be distracted by JessE's accusations etc.
I've simply got better things to do with my free time than to debate something with someone who isn't informed on the topic, and is just interested in spouting conspiracy theories.
Edit: coop I just saw your post to the same patent on the 12th of April... didn't realize you had posted it already. Nice addition.
-Chimera
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J
JessE
Guest
Loose enough for you now?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1UERsne3D0&feature=related
Lesson number 342 in The Twilight Zone
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1UERsne3D0&feature=related
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my last post in this thread... simply too many nutters for me
Paranoia is one of the most unpleasant "side effects" of marijuana. It's also a key experience shared by marijuana smokers and people with schizophrenia. But exactly how does smoking a joint cause the feeling that dark forces are conspiring to do you wrong?
New research in rats may help explain the source of this distress. The study, led by Steven Laviolette at the University of Western Ontario in Canada, involved training rats to fear the scent of either almond or peppermint. The scents were delivered to rats in a cage either with black-and-white striped walls or with black polka dots on a gray background. (The rats were not pre-tested for their taste in interior design.) One scent was accompanied by an electric shock to the rodents' feet, while the other scent was not.
At the same time, researchers experimented with the activity of the CB1 receptors in a certain region of the rats' brains. These cannabinoid receptors are activated by the main psychoactive component of marijuana, THC. In some rats, the scientists blocked CB1-receptor activity; in others, they used a marijuana-like drug to enhance it.
When scientists blocked the CB1 receptors in a region called the basolateral amygdala — which is involved in the processing of fear and emotion — the rats that got strong electric shocks did not learn to fear the associated scent or the cage in which they received it. After getting shocked, they were just as happy as unaffected rats to explore the cage and smell the scent.
When rats were given a drug that enhanced cannabinoid-receptor activity, however, even receiving a minor shock was enough to cause them to freeze with fear when they were later exposed to the cage and its related scent. Without the marijuana-like drug, small shocks did not have the same effect.
The findings, published in the Journal of Neuroscience, suggest that activity in the basolateral amygdala is involved in marijuana-induced paranoia (the state of becoming afraid of things that wouldn't normally trigger fear). That means marijuana is actually enhancing a type of learning about fear, leading the brain to jump to conclusions about mild experiences involving particular places or things, and to perceive them as scarier and more strongly connected than they are.
This increased fear-based learning helps explain why stoners tend to see patterns in events that aren't real, such as conspiracies. (Of course, to be fair, the rats in this experiment were justifiably paranoid: they were being experimented on!)
Interestingly, the researchers also found that they could prevent the enhanced fear learning in rats given the marijuana-like drug by inactivating activity in a region called the prefrontal cortex before exposing them to the shocks. The prefrontal cortex is a higher-level brain area involved in executive functions like planning, decision-making and controlling responses and impulses. In humans, this could potentially explain why telling yourself or being told, "Chill out, you're just high," can help. (This may not work if the police actually are coming to arrest you.)
The researchers point out that both of the brain regions studied are implicated in the pathology of schizophrenia, and that understanding their interconnections could lead to better treatments for the disorder.
"We know there are abnormalities in both the amygdala and prefrontal cortex in patients who have schizophrenia, and we now know these same brain areas are critical to the effects of marijuana and other cannabinoid drugs on emotional processing," said Laviolette in a statement.
Read more: A Rat Study Helps Explain Why Pot Smokers and People With Schizophrenia Are Paranoid - - TIME Healthland
Paranoia is one of the most unpleasant "side effects" of marijuana. It's also a key experience shared by marijuana smokers and people with schizophrenia. But exactly how does smoking a joint cause the feeling that dark forces are conspiring to do you wrong?
New research in rats may help explain the source of this distress. The study, led by Steven Laviolette at the University of Western Ontario in Canada, involved training rats to fear the scent of either almond or peppermint. The scents were delivered to rats in a cage either with black-and-white striped walls or with black polka dots on a gray background. (The rats were not pre-tested for their taste in interior design.) One scent was accompanied by an electric shock to the rodents' feet, while the other scent was not.
At the same time, researchers experimented with the activity of the CB1 receptors in a certain region of the rats' brains. These cannabinoid receptors are activated by the main psychoactive component of marijuana, THC. In some rats, the scientists blocked CB1-receptor activity; in others, they used a marijuana-like drug to enhance it.
When scientists blocked the CB1 receptors in a region called the basolateral amygdala — which is involved in the processing of fear and emotion — the rats that got strong electric shocks did not learn to fear the associated scent or the cage in which they received it. After getting shocked, they were just as happy as unaffected rats to explore the cage and smell the scent.
When rats were given a drug that enhanced cannabinoid-receptor activity, however, even receiving a minor shock was enough to cause them to freeze with fear when they were later exposed to the cage and its related scent. Without the marijuana-like drug, small shocks did not have the same effect.
The findings, published in the Journal of Neuroscience, suggest that activity in the basolateral amygdala is involved in marijuana-induced paranoia (the state of becoming afraid of things that wouldn't normally trigger fear). That means marijuana is actually enhancing a type of learning about fear, leading the brain to jump to conclusions about mild experiences involving particular places or things, and to perceive them as scarier and more strongly connected than they are.
This increased fear-based learning helps explain why stoners tend to see patterns in events that aren't real, such as conspiracies. (Of course, to be fair, the rats in this experiment were justifiably paranoid: they were being experimented on!)
Interestingly, the researchers also found that they could prevent the enhanced fear learning in rats given the marijuana-like drug by inactivating activity in a region called the prefrontal cortex before exposing them to the shocks. The prefrontal cortex is a higher-level brain area involved in executive functions like planning, decision-making and controlling responses and impulses. In humans, this could potentially explain why telling yourself or being told, "Chill out, you're just high," can help. (This may not work if the police actually are coming to arrest you.)
The researchers point out that both of the brain regions studied are implicated in the pathology of schizophrenia, and that understanding their interconnections could lead to better treatments for the disorder.
"We know there are abnormalities in both the amygdala and prefrontal cortex in patients who have schizophrenia, and we now know these same brain areas are critical to the effects of marijuana and other cannabinoid drugs on emotional processing," said Laviolette in a statement.
Read more: A Rat Study Helps Explain Why Pot Smokers and People With Schizophrenia Are Paranoid - - TIME Healthland
D
Donald Mallard
Guest
I dont mean to offend you jesse
but after reading many many threads you are active in
it seems you are scared of folks with intellect beyond your own .
if they have something to offer more than your offering ,
you seem to want to taunt them , and even make fun of their credentials ...
given we are all part of a team , imho it would be very cool if you were t o accept the whole team and what they can and have to give , and try and stop the segregation ...
Just an observation ,, thankfully im not clever enough to draw your attention , hehehe ..
but after reading many many threads you are active in
it seems you are scared of folks with intellect beyond your own .
if they have something to offer more than your offering ,
you seem to want to taunt them , and even make fun of their credentials ...
given we are all part of a team , imho it would be very cool if you were t o accept the whole team and what they can and have to give , and try and stop the segregation ...
Just an observation ,, thankfully im not clever enough to draw your attention , hehehe ..
F
fishy
Guest
deleted by me
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slightly off topic so apologies Jesse but..
Regarding this d.watson fella,by all accounts he isnt just an unreliable self-server,liar & fool but rather something much more dangerous,this is someone who alledgedly[you explain it any other way im all ears]grassed up his partners which led him into a life as a DEA rat.A DEA rat who was prepared to jail friends,split up families,profit out of misery whilst having not a shred of honour about him.
Now i find out he wants to fuck up our beloved herb in such a way that recovery might not be possible.
Q-Why is he still breathing???
Any other group of people would have removed this shitbag from the comunity one way or another,so as much as i understand why folks who have been around him like Neville really can't stand him ,what i dont get is why he has been allowed to continue unhindered since the 80's??
Sure the DEA dont want to lose an asset but they wouldnt even investigate because it leads back to them,more likely they would quickly forget and groom the next david watson up.
Just a thought guys n gals.
Again sorry for posting this here Jesse but it very much was started by me reading the first couple of pages on here and some links,i realise the topic has moved on but if i didnt say this now i would have forgot my question.
Regarding this d.watson fella,by all accounts he isnt just an unreliable self-server,liar & fool but rather something much more dangerous,this is someone who alledgedly[you explain it any other way im all ears]grassed up his partners which led him into a life as a DEA rat.A DEA rat who was prepared to jail friends,split up families,profit out of misery whilst having not a shred of honour about him.
Now i find out he wants to fuck up our beloved herb in such a way that recovery might not be possible.
Q-Why is he still breathing???
Any other group of people would have removed this shitbag from the comunity one way or another,so as much as i understand why folks who have been around him like Neville really can't stand him ,what i dont get is why he has been allowed to continue unhindered since the 80's??
Sure the DEA dont want to lose an asset but they wouldnt even investigate because it leads back to them,more likely they would quickly forget and groom the next david watson up.
Just a thought guys n gals.
Again sorry for posting this here Jesse but it very much was started by me reading the first couple of pages on here and some links,i realise the topic has moved on but if i didnt say this now i would have forgot my question.
J
JessE
Guest
Hey nobody
Thanks for posting, though I must say right off the bat I do not advocate any harm coming to the Skunk man. Simply put, unless we have DEA files linking Skunk man directly to anything it is all speculation. What we do have is plenty of information from many sources which paint a picture which leads to many questions. Most of which posted in various threads here at MNS originally.
This is the scary part, this all happened long ago. If it wasnt for threads such as The Fertilizer of Economic Growth and other similar works, which have only came out relatively recently, the online cannabis community would absolutely be in the dark even right now.
So where was the entire industry at, to let us know this information which is seemingly significant enough to capture so manys attention? There was a black out of information on so many forums, for so long, and even today has been covered up by deleting anything and everyone associated with the presentation of the information that one has to wonder, simply put, what the fuck?
I had first got wind of the basic details of some of the information in question long ago privately, I am talking about, years!! Five easily. And it was not posted on then, or previously, and I have been posting online for a decade. The first mention I saw of anything publicly was from a post Shanti did at an Italian forum/magazine. From there I posted some related research on this forum and Icmag, which was subsequently deleted by the mods and I was banned (see youtube video lol). I would personally think, and do think, that the community would love to know the information presented. Yet it is covered up for what reason?
I think you're right on track with your frustrations, though I am not a violent man and do not advocate harm on to others. But I do think taking a close look at what Hortapharm and GW Pharm have did in the past and now is quite significant. And thus why this thread is here.
Thanks for participating.
C
coop
Guest
i don't want to add more fuel to fire.
But after reading a lot of sam's supposed online postings, I wonder if he actualyl reads any of the work hortipharm published. But he asks too many questions on papers he should have already read. just my honest opinion on the subject.
I'm not taking sides here, but Chimera and Vic as well as others tried doing something similar in the late 90s. If you dig around you can find a lot of that stuff still but its amazing how much of the breeders info contradicts with info nowadays. (more that important info was left out over the years) So people are confused about the topics they where originally discussing, but i think they might have been on the tip of the fem iceburg a decade ago
I would propose some online classes or something, but would be great if we could get some members of the board with educational and industry experience to explain what goes on. I don't know where you would start but i guess Biology 101 would be helpful for a lot of us.
But after reading a lot of sam's supposed online postings, I wonder if he actualyl reads any of the work hortipharm published. But he asks too many questions on papers he should have already read. just my honest opinion on the subject.
I'm not taking sides here, but Chimera and Vic as well as others tried doing something similar in the late 90s. If you dig around you can find a lot of that stuff still but its amazing how much of the breeders info contradicts with info nowadays. (more that important info was left out over the years) So people are confused about the topics they where originally discussing, but i think they might have been on the tip of the fem iceburg a decade ago
I would propose some online classes or something, but would be great if we could get some members of the board with educational and industry experience to explain what goes on. I don't know where you would start but i guess Biology 101 would be helpful for a lot of us.
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U
Unclepeter
Guest
yeah the shitbag thats done more for a community than you, I and friggin Nev.... is he on the board at GW? errrr no he fuckin isn't... lots of you are deluded....
F
fishy
Guest
Fish's HMBB smoke report
deleted by me
deleted by me
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F
fishy
Guest
^ whoops...wrong thread.
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They might not even teach biology in schools anymore m8,i think chemistry and biology has been amalgamated but not 100% on this,but it is a good idea non the less about some kind of open uni thing.
A retired teacher who likes to get stoned would be a very valuable asset to many of us and we could pay him/her for their time with beans or some kind of thankyou.
Information is out there and classes could be copied and posted on the forum but without someone to guide us through and be able to answer questions on the subject in hand it wouldnt be as potent or effective.
A retired teacher who likes to get stoned would be a very valuable asset to many of us and we could pay him/her for their time with beans or some kind of thankyou.
Information is out there and classes could be copied and posted on the forum but without someone to guide us through and be able to answer questions on the subject in hand it wouldnt be as potent or effective.
J
JessE
Guest
Hi all,
Rounding back into topic, the potentials for marijuana and cannabis based inventions of all sorts is wide open. For the time being however, and in almost everyones living memory today, the cannabis plant has been subject to a prohibition that is paralleled by few plants today. Thus the knowns are in short supply, and tomorrow very much an open question mark, simply because we do not have a modern day history to draw inferences from.
The Skunk #1 plant is a variety with an interesting pedigree, one which is perhaps quite a bit more diverse in its truest form then many of us realize compared to its modern day progeny/ancestors which it is has no doubt helped influence. I would wager there is quite a bit of room to maneuver direction wise in the breeding of the variety, and even if you bred a variety such as Shit from an otherwise Sativa expressive group of plants from Skunk#1, at the end of the day that variety is still going to be a derivative of Skunk#1.
It would be interesting to discuss the possibility of even more defined breeding practices within a known and influential gene pool as as Skunk#1. For example, plants which are bred for specific medical values. Even breeding programs with the most regimented of goals, at the end of the day are genetically bound to their original predecessors. If patents were to be granted on even plants which have went through refined programs such as this, but were still based on industry foundations such as Skunk#1, what could this mean in the future?
A point which I often like to point too is how Monsanto has managed to patent certain agricultural lines which are the result of their Round 'up Ready lines. Monsanto is a very powerful company, and a good starting to point to draw parallels about what could happen in the future with other powerful companies who invest mega dollars into something they have a vision for. Monsanto has aggressively enforced even the most honest of infringements against its patented lines. Going after farmers whose crops had accidentally been pollinated by neighbors using round up ready products.
Doesnt sound right does it? But thats how these things operate. And who among us is willing to give the future, already experiencing the influx of those with more money than canna-love, the benefit of the doubt? That they wont do this, or they wont do that? How can you know what they will and will not do, based on the prohibition lead question mark of a history we have to draw on? A lot of people like to draw parallels to corn in breeding discussions, but some of those same people will turn a blind eye to the patent issues arising from maze pollinated by patented lines, accidentally or otherwise when it comes to discussions such as this.
There are a number of people who are responsible for Skunk #1's subsequent breeding prowess in the industry today as well. Lines which may have originated by Skunk Man originally in Holland, were assimilated by many others, who put a great deal of work into their own visions of the line. But no matter which direction those individuals took the line, they too, are still bound by their genetic history and will thus be directly related to their predecessors.
As we have demonstrated already, a number of very popular varieties have been shared with G.W Pharmaceuticals. Who have all but guaranteed used those same lines in their efforts to produce their flag ship product, Sativex. And we have some big names at GW specifically warning about patents and infringements. Examining the specifics of the relationship between Hortapharm and GW in relation to the use of those plants is also an interesting point to consider when discussing the possibility of patents on plants. Some of the varieties in question were never turned over to GW exclusively, but rather agreements were reached. Which offers a glimpse, of already known intentions, by Skunk Man and company on protecting said genetic property. Even if the story isnt as cut and dry as popular ideology may suggest.
A great deal of the histories of main lines are in question in the industry today. The known history of the lines originally brought to Holland by Skunk Man is a subject worthy of a thread all of their own. Where did Skunk Man get Skunk #1? Nevil had an interesting recollection of the history of the variety as originally told to him by Skunk Man, which is a little bit different than what Sam has lead us to believe online. There are a couple examples of similar stories within the industry of individuals bringing lines to Holland, which they are now credited for. But where did those lines come from originally? The knowns start with the genetics arrival in Holland, the question marks start with before their arrival on Dutch soil.
Rounding back into topic, the potentials for marijuana and cannabis based inventions of all sorts is wide open. For the time being however, and in almost everyones living memory today, the cannabis plant has been subject to a prohibition that is paralleled by few plants today. Thus the knowns are in short supply, and tomorrow very much an open question mark, simply because we do not have a modern day history to draw inferences from.
The Skunk #1 plant is a variety with an interesting pedigree, one which is perhaps quite a bit more diverse in its truest form then many of us realize compared to its modern day progeny/ancestors which it is has no doubt helped influence. I would wager there is quite a bit of room to maneuver direction wise in the breeding of the variety, and even if you bred a variety such as Shit from an otherwise Sativa expressive group of plants from Skunk#1, at the end of the day that variety is still going to be a derivative of Skunk#1.
It would be interesting to discuss the possibility of even more defined breeding practices within a known and influential gene pool as as Skunk#1. For example, plants which are bred for specific medical values. Even breeding programs with the most regimented of goals, at the end of the day are genetically bound to their original predecessors. If patents were to be granted on even plants which have went through refined programs such as this, but were still based on industry foundations such as Skunk#1, what could this mean in the future?
A point which I often like to point too is how Monsanto has managed to patent certain agricultural lines which are the result of their Round 'up Ready lines. Monsanto is a very powerful company, and a good starting to point to draw parallels about what could happen in the future with other powerful companies who invest mega dollars into something they have a vision for. Monsanto has aggressively enforced even the most honest of infringements against its patented lines. Going after farmers whose crops had accidentally been pollinated by neighbors using round up ready products.
Doesnt sound right does it? But thats how these things operate. And who among us is willing to give the future, already experiencing the influx of those with more money than canna-love, the benefit of the doubt? That they wont do this, or they wont do that? How can you know what they will and will not do, based on the prohibition lead question mark of a history we have to draw on? A lot of people like to draw parallels to corn in breeding discussions, but some of those same people will turn a blind eye to the patent issues arising from maze pollinated by patented lines, accidentally or otherwise when it comes to discussions such as this.
There are a number of people who are responsible for Skunk #1's subsequent breeding prowess in the industry today as well. Lines which may have originated by Skunk Man originally in Holland, were assimilated by many others, who put a great deal of work into their own visions of the line. But no matter which direction those individuals took the line, they too, are still bound by their genetic history and will thus be directly related to their predecessors.
As we have demonstrated already, a number of very popular varieties have been shared with G.W Pharmaceuticals. Who have all but guaranteed used those same lines in their efforts to produce their flag ship product, Sativex. And we have some big names at GW specifically warning about patents and infringements. Examining the specifics of the relationship between Hortapharm and GW in relation to the use of those plants is also an interesting point to consider when discussing the possibility of patents on plants. Some of the varieties in question were never turned over to GW exclusively, but rather agreements were reached. Which offers a glimpse, of already known intentions, by Skunk Man and company on protecting said genetic property. Even if the story isnt as cut and dry as popular ideology may suggest.
A great deal of the histories of main lines are in question in the industry today. The known history of the lines originally brought to Holland by Skunk Man is a subject worthy of a thread all of their own. Where did Skunk Man get Skunk #1? Nevil had an interesting recollection of the history of the variety as originally told to him by Skunk Man, which is a little bit different than what Sam has lead us to believe online. There are a couple examples of similar stories within the industry of individuals bringing lines to Holland, which they are now credited for. But where did those lines come from originally? The knowns start with the genetics arrival in Holland, the question marks start with before their arrival on Dutch soil.
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GreenintheThumb
New member
Are you guys planning on working with donors outside of what I assume is Spain? How do you plan to tackle these legal issues. Feel free to discuss this in pm if it's not an appropriate subject out in the open.
Respect to you Chimera, I had just happened to be pulling every patent GW applied for in the last 5 years this week in getting some investors up to speed. Funny coincidence. Keep fighting the good fight my friend.
C
coop
Guest
jesse brings up an important issue.
Which is true. Control of a variety of plant, that some people have spent since they claim the late 60s developing.
The truth is less strange then fiction. And i'd love to write it up but i need more sources, but there is proof that they have worked certian lines for decades now and their goal all along was to have breeders rights on those plants. With any other crop this would be a non-issue.
If anyone has access to some uk databases let me know, you could dig up some pretty amazing info if you know where to look.
Which is true. Control of a variety of plant, that some people have spent since they claim the late 60s developing.
The truth is less strange then fiction. And i'd love to write it up but i need more sources, but there is proof that they have worked certian lines for decades now and their goal all along was to have breeders rights on those plants. With any other crop this would be a non-issue.
If anyone has access to some uk databases let me know, you could dig up some pretty amazing info if you know where to look.
B
british_hempire
Guest
I'm in the UK so tell me where to look!
J
JessE
Guest
Hi all,
Below is the article, "Corporate Take Over" which appeared in issue 91 of Weed World Magazine. Special thanks to Shantibaba and Phil at Weed World, two of the best guys in the industry no question about it.
C
coop
Guest
right on,
one of the best articles i've read from you JessE, this i can agree with.
And am agreeing with.
Nevil was right with his last post too
one of the best articles i've read from you JessE, this i can agree with.
And am agreeing with.
Nevil was right with his last post too