The Fertilizer of Economic Growth

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Green Fingers And A Artistic Bent

CosaNostra:)
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That's A Keeper , For Sure !
Wishing You And Yours A Very Festive Holiday Season
Naddolig Llawen i Chi A Tuely
Dda Iawn Boyo
Joe/Pete:)
 
Hi All MNS family members

Sorry for my absence but I am in a place that internet rarely reaches and doing an eco project with several other life friends...a dream we are making reality. But the dreams , which are not without stumbling blocks, are only possible with everyone(as different as we all are) pulling their weight and looking for solutions rather than hampering and stalling the big picture and each other.No matter our differences or our histories we are all judged on our last game, in the end.

I did not read all of what everyone wrote within, but enough to realize you are not accepting each others differences , and being civil. That disappoints me as this site was set up for intelligent, informative, cutting edge type of fanatics we all are ...which is why we all interact here.We may never know what the truth is or what each other looks like, but that did not stop us from being civil or giving each other a chance to express our opinions constructively before. So what is it? Did the family get too big? Did people stop being humble? Did we begin to act like all the other sites we tried to run away from? Whatever the reasons, there are no acceptible rationalisations for me to ever start treating people any other way than how i want to be treated! So no matter what the belief is of each individual here on any topic, they should all be able to be voiced equally, and with respect ...no matter whether we agree or not.

I know all the characters in the cannabis world, not equally but enough to understand we are all on the same side. Howard,Neville,Sam, Rob, Eddie, Werner, Arjan, Ben etc...are who they choose to be, motivated by whatever got them out of bed to work in this industry that did not exist openly 40 years ago.So do not loose site of the big picture because glory or greed or whatever cloud your view at times.The real history of many things in man`s past is debatable to this day, like Tessler , or Darwin or Columbus, and it will never be resolved since history fades facts into legends. It is easy to use money to try and shout the loudest, but in time you the person reading and digesting stories and facts make the truth from how you sum up who is believeable. It does not matter , what does matter is that you decide how you feel ultimately no one else.So be mature, funny and constructive...treat people with respect even if you cannot stand what they say, cause in the end the real truth is all men live together on one planet and breathe the same air. We are all on the same side regardless of beliefs or culture or colour of our skin, so do not forget what is blatently the real truth. Do not become what you always hated in the world, and then you will be worthy to live this life we have been gifted to see....

So merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all of my family of MNS...make me proud to know you all and individually, even if we never meet in person or see each other...All the best Shantibaba
 
shantibaba said:
Hi All MNS family members

Sorry for my absence but I am in a place that internet rarely reaches and doing an eco project with several other life friends...a dream we are making reality. But the dreams , which are not without stumbling blocks, are only possible with everyone(as different as we all are) pulling their weight and looking for solutions rather than hampering and stalling the big picture and each other.No matter our differences or our histories we are all judged on our last game, in the end.

I did not read all of what everyone wrote within, but enough to realize you are not accepting each others differences , and being civil. That disappoints me as this site was set up for intelligent, informative, cutting edge type of fanatics we all are ...which is why we all interact here.We may never know what the truth is or what each other looks like, but that did not stop us from being civil or giving each other a chance to express our opinions constructively before. So what is it? Did the family get too big? Did people stop being humble? Did we begin to act like all the other sites we tried to run away from? Whatever the reasons, there are no acceptible rationalisations for me to ever start treating people any other way than how i want to be treated! So no matter what the belief is of each individual here on any topic, they should all be able to be voiced equally, and with respect ...no matter whether we agree or not.

I know all the characters in the cannabis world, not equally but enough to understand we are all on the same side. Howard,Neville,Sam, Rob, Eddie, Werner, Arjan, Ben etc...are who they choose to be, motivated by whatever got them out of bed to work in this industry that did not exist openly 40 years ago.So do not loose site of the big picture because glory or greed or whatever cloud your view at times.The real history of many things in man`s past is debatable to this day, like Tessler , or Darwin or Columbus, and it will never be resolved since history fades facts into legends. It is easy to use money to try and shout the loudest, but in time you the person reading and digesting stories and facts make the truth from how you sum up who is believeable. It does not matter , what does matter is that you decide how you feel ultimately no one else.So be mature, funny and constructive...treat people with respect even if you cannot stand what they say, cause in the end the real truth is all men live together on one planet and breathe the same air. We are all on the same side regardless of beliefs or culture or colour of our skin, so do not forget what is blatently the real truth. Do not become what you always hated in the world, and then you will be worthy to live this life we have been gifted to see....

So merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all of my family of MNS...make me proud to know you all and individually, even if we never meet in person or see each other...All the best Shantibaba
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Well said my friend! My New Years resolution is .... to try and work with everyone in our industry. For those of whom I have had problems with in the past I offer an olive branch.

Take Care and Peace
Marco Renda
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Over my head

What I do Know is besides the fact of the money they the big firms make they don't want the third world countries to have a way to pay for their own food and life. They would rather watch little baby's starve while we sit on food mountains I'm just a street guy a noone that has been in the gutter homeless and with a habit. It is only due to my plants I'm clean and warm. I also now have full custody of my 4 year old little girl.All thanks to my relationship with the plant and it's care.Child Protection got called in by mother inlaw and they said it would not benifit my little girl in any way should they investigate my Cannabis use any farther. They were told I was Growing
 
Hi all :)
Below is an article I was recently able to source and thought to add to the discussion here at the forum. One would be surprised what kind of information is available with a bit of diligence.

Hortapharm Article in Dutch Newspaper

Trouw 18 juli 1998
(translated)
"Controversial Medi-weed firm Hortapharm has again requested a license from the ministry of Health.The request follows after recently Minister Borst informed the firm they are not allowed to trade in THC. Hortapharm has made an appeal in court against that decision.The ministry has had issues with the firm for a few years now. In September 1994 Hortapharm was granted a license. The license meant they were allowed to grow cannabis for research purposes in greenhouses in Aalsmeer.

This research entailed breeding weed with the aim to get the THC content as high as possible. According to the firm, pure THC can benefit appetite in aids patients, and lesses sickness of cancerpatients undergoing chemo and to help MS patients.
A synthetic version of THC, Marinol, has already been on the market for years in North America, Israel, Australia, South-Africa and Puerto Rico.

According to David Watson, owner of Hortapharm, the cannabis derived product is significantly cheaper and in the long run better than Marinol, which would make it a serious competitor for tyhe pharmaceutical industry.. He doesn’t understand why the Dutch Goverment does not allow him to have access to this lucrative market. A market which he estimates to be a least a hundred million guilders.

Documents from the ministry of health show Hortapharm has linked itself with British firm Generics in Potters Bar. A twenty year agreement had been signed to develop the medicine “Naturbinol” on the basis of Hortapharms’ seed produced in Holland.

Hortapharm also has linked itself with Institut für Onkologische und Immunologische Forschung in Berlin. Both genercis and the Berlin Institute claim Hortpharms’ seeds are beneficial to them. But Hortapharm is not allowed to trade these seeds.Cannabis seed trading is allowed, but not the trading of THC. Hortapharm was provided with a one time only export license, for non commercial research purposes.Watson continues to fight for a tradelicence in Holland, and has said the commercial part of his firm has been moved to the UK, under GW. Only the delivery of technology and seeds continues from Holland.

From a not published before statement of the commission of complaints(?) of the ministry of health however, some remarkable facts arise. Those facts don’t only say something about Hortapharm itself, but about the people involved in the inspection too. (say something as in, characteristic)

The in September expired license was granted on the basis that Hortapharm would act “good and trustworthy” under the license. The minister states however that the firm, despite several warnings, didn’t keep to the agreement. Hortapharm grew a significant larger amount than necessary for THC extraction. During an inspection, 250 kilo’s of Cannabis, 12 kilo’s of shredded cannabis and cannabis oil where found. The administration of the firm had not been done according to regulation and plants were not destroyed in the prescribed way. The latter means a notary act of the destruction has been written.

They found 250 kilo’s of cannabis would privide 25 kilo’s of THC, while the amount of THC Hortapharm was allowed to have on premises where 10 gramms.Watson denies fervently the firm has messed with the paperwork. Apparently part of the paperwork was sent to the minister but gotten lost there.

Whether Watson has done dodgy things with his firm has not really been investigated. It is remarkable however that, despite the ministerial warnings, the firm was simply allowed to continue for three years. It is even more remarkable considering the fact during question time in Parliament last year, minister Borst already claimed there were doubts whether Hortapharm only grew hemp for science purposes.

Despite all these doubts Hortapharm is still trading and Watson continues his battle for a license in Holland. Factually speaking, the firm trades on a license which has run out. In legal terms that means Hortapharm is an illegal weed growing business.
The general ministry is aware of the situation, but doesn’t wish to comment about the matter for the foreseeable future."
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http://www.trouw.nl/krantenarchief/1998/07/18/2498016/Omstreden_medi-weedbedrijf_wil_handelen.html
 
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Below is part of a conversation which took place here at MNS in the 'Origins of Haze' thread last year sometime. Recently I was working with different translations of the articles Ive found in Dutch, and I ran across an article which sounded vaguely familiar. (see the source below for further details).

Originally posted by Shantibaba

but when it was revealed that Sam and his crew of Americans in Holland all were part of informants for the DEA in America on a radio program in Holland they split to the UK to do other things. Sam never started or owned a seed company so his claim to all the strains that became famous years ago are not really warranted.
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Below is a quote from our very own l33t, where he is describing information he recently came across while researching this very same subject.

Originally posted by l33t
Its in Dutch and the various free online translation services on the web ain't doing the best job but bottomline is that in this news article Sam was revealed to be a DEA informant that fought his competitors by indicating them to justice in order to get his license/permit to grow. In the news article its also suggested that Sam was released/left by DEA in Holland so that many years after he would 'play on' 'Skunk'breeders' names.It is also mentioned there that Sam had a police record.
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http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=120563&page=6

When pressed on the subject more, l33t went on too explain.
Finally, what the hell does "In the news article its also suggested that Sam was released/left by DEA in Holland so that many years after he would 'play on' 'Skunk'breeders' names.It is also mentioned there that Sam had a police record." that even mean? Play on skunk breeders names? WTF? Is this perhaps a really piss poor translation of "breeding on skunk lines"? Only thing I can figure.
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Originally posted by l33t

No , all online translations seem to 'say' what I wrote , "play on 'Skunk'breeders' names". I speak German myself and Dutch are quite similar and it clearly seems to me that these are all correct translation. Afterall I used a lot of different free online translation services to double check on that and all gave the same kind of results.Plus what is stated in the reports seems just like what Shanti wrote about Sam, that Sam's "claim to all the strains that became famous many years ago is not really warranted".
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http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=120563&page=6

(out the link below)
http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/showthread.php?t=1606&page=7
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http://www.volkskrant.nl/archief_gratis/article743261.ece/WEEKBLADEN
 
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JessE said:
Below is part of a conversation which took place here at MNS in the 'Origins of Haze' thread last year sometime. Recently I was working with different translations of the articles Ive found in Dutch, and I ran across an article which sounded vaguely familiar. (see the source below for further details).

http://www.volkskrant.nl/archief_gratis/article743261.ece/WEEKBLADEN
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First article is a normal Cannabis Company trying to get a permit from the goverment (remember that cannabis is illegal).

The second one seems like rumors if I where you I would contact that Henk Blanken guy.
 
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Hello Mrs. Sam ,

Is your husband still involved with with Hortapharm and the other company in the UK ?

Doesn't having a legitimate cannabis company with permits protect your husband regardless of what name he chooses to use?
People usuually don't "out" each other unless money or jail is involved. However, if the DEA wanted to know you better they could very easily but probably wouldn't bother some 70 year old guy who has some colorful history .

A private grudge might be in order if any loss occurred, but time has a way of making important shit seem "un" important. Some accurate and mutual recall might be nice for the archives, but I don't hold my breath.

Why the sudden examination and questioning of Sam's life and work, Mrs. Sam? Any theories?
 
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Genetic Variation in Hemp and Marijuana (Cannabis sativa L.) According to Amplified Fragment Length Polymorphisms*
Shannon L. Datwyler, Ph.D. 1,2 ; and George D. Weiblen, Ph.D. 2
1 Department of Plant Biology, University of Minnesota, 1445 Gortner Avenue, Saint Paul, MN 55108.
2 Present Address: Department of Biological Sciences, California State University, Sacramento, 6000 J Street, Sacramento, CA 95819.
Correspondence to Additional information and reprint requests:
George D. Weiblen, Ph.D
Department of Plant Biology
University of Minnesota
1445 Gortner Avenue
Saint Paul, MN 55108
E-mail: gweiblen@umn.edu

*HortaPharm B.V. (the Netherlands) and Kenex Ltd. (Canada) provided controlled substances for research registered and permitted by the United States Drug Enforcement Administration and the Minnesota Board of Pharmacy with support from the David and Lucille Packard Foundation and the Minnesota Agricultural Experiment Station. The study was first presented at the Botanical Society of America Annual Meeting in 2004 at Snowbird, Utah.
Copyright Copyright © 2006 by American Academy of Forensic Sciences
KEYWORDS
forensic science • DNA typing • amplified fragment length polymorphism • analysis of molecular variance • heterozygosity • DNA fingerprinting • sex linkage
ABSTRACT

ABSTRACT: Cannabis sativa L. (Cannabaceae) is one of the earliest known cultivated plants and is important in the global economy today as a licit and an illicit crop. Molecular markers distinguishing licit and illicit cultivars have forensic utility, but no direct comparison of hemp and marijuana amplified fragment length polymorphism (AFLP) has been made to date. Genetic variation was surveyed in three populations of fiber hemp and a potent cultivar of marijuana using AFLP markers. Ten primer pairs yielded 1206 bands, of which 88% were polymorphic. Eighteen bands represented fixed differences between all fiber populations and the drug cultivar. These markers have practical utility for (1) establishing conspiracy in the cultivation and distribution of marijuana, (2) identifying geographic sources of seized drugs, and (3) discriminating illegal, potent marijuana cultivars from hemp where the cultivation of industrial hemp is permitted.

Received 17 Dec. 2005; and in revised form 21 July and 3 Oct. 2005; accepted 22 Oct. 2005; published 13 Feb. 2006.
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Another one

Identification of candidate genes affecting Δ9-tetrahydrocannabinol biosynthesis in Cannabis sativa
M. David Marks,1* Li Tian,2† Jonathan P. Wenger,1 Stephanie N. Omburo,1 Wilfredo Soto-Fuentes,1 Ji He,2 David R. Gang,3 George D. Weiblen,1 and Richard A. Dixon2

Plant growth and gland isolation
Seeds from the marijuana cultivar Skunk no. 1 were provided by HortaPharm BV (Amsterdam, The Netherlands) and imported under a US Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) permit to a registered controlled substance research facility.
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http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2736886/pdf/erp210.pdf

Interesting articles BTW

Namaste :)
 
Clearly states there Sam got a license from the DEA to export to the USA and Canada. A normal procedure for importing control substances in the states.

Maybe people confuse these part and made it to "he left to UK part because of snitching ppl".
 
economic growth

As the title of the thread states, I feel any of Sam's possible bs is for his 'economic growth', not something sinister.

Sure, the DEA know all about Sam, they would have to, to do their job. The DEA is also a regulating entity when it comes to research. They are not 'the enemy'. They are mandated to carry out statutes which politicians establish in legislation and executive decisions. The judiciary are largely political also in that they are appointed mostly by the politicians in the executive and confirmed by politicians in the legislature. I am speaking of the U.S. system, the driver of the drug war in the past 40 years.:(

What influences and elects the politicians is public opinion expressed in votes. Cannabis prohibition in the U.S. stems from racial bigotry against Blacks and Mexicans 80 years ago. This is a clear fact, undisputed. Also, Cannabis prohibition provided 'jobs' for Anslinger and anti-alcohol agents when booze prohibition was repealed.

The best way forward for Cannabis normalization IME is getting the truth out to the public. ;)

A compelling argument can be made for normalization: America is at war on too many fronts. Removing the 'contraband' status of pot would allow monitoring resources to be directed to 'enemies' and away from otherwise ordinary citizens. This needs to happen sooner rather than later.
 
Its correct that it is a normal procedure for getting a permit by the DEA, but the question is where did the controlled substance come from.By my knowledge Hortapharm did never get a permit from the Dutch authorities for export of THC related products to research facilities abroad,unless its from GW Pharmaceuticals.:rolleyes:

Welcome to the website of Bedrocan BV Medicinal Cannabis. Since the first of march 2005 Bedrocan BV is the only company contracted by the Ministry of Health, Welfare and Sport for the growth and production of medicinal Cannabis. Cannabis Flos Bedrocan®, Bedrobinol® and Bediol® can be prescribed by doctors for both humans and animals.
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Namaste :)
 
This thread is nothing more than a joke. I still do not see what the big fuckin deal is over all of this? Going by what is said on here, I must work for the fuckin DEA too b/c I had to have clearence and special Gov't permits to do my internship when I was getting my organic chemistry degree.:rolleyes:
 
Read Jesse post and the newspaper article he post. There it is stated that HortaPharm had a permit.

How do you think GW got Sativex at a beginning. (Recently approved medicament in Spain).
 
If you live in the US and you want to do research with controlled substances, yes than you need a permit from the DEA.I understand that for that reason, so thats not the point, but i assume that in the Netherlands you need a permit by the Ministry of Health, Welfare and Sport for the production & export of THC related substances.So the big question is who is in charge in the Netherlands the DEA or the Dutch Ministry of Health, Welfare and Sport.

Every country has his own agency for controlled substances, so its not a big deal at all that you need a permit from those agencies and not from a foreign one.;)

Namaste :)
 
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