Grail: The Ultimate Haze Hybrid

[joshuahazen]

Good personal report joshua, the theme of which coincides with what Scorpion has stated about what Nevil calls, "5Haze". On another note, I've sat and shared an MM cross spliff with Nevil, and he initially found it hard to believe it wasn't 5Haze. Anyway, I'm betting some early Thai stick that hit the US shores would have stacked up favorably to 5Haze, and was the chief progenitor of it. Now we have that same element from a different source, let's see what the maestro can achieve.

Thanks BW.

That is so awesome.


I agree the common denominator is probably Thai, but it just may be other things as well.

Whatever it is, I know the "Movies flashing in my Head" phenomenon. I used to hear like, full orchestral symphonies in my head, on the 5hz and I am not even a huge fan of classical. or the sound the waves used to make Beneath the cliffs of Big Sur, it literally made me feel like my head was filling up with bubbles that were bursting.

I am willing to wager that it is going to be something from beyond the beyond.

With Kangas Madness in the King's hand...
--Soon we just may be sipping Holy Water from the Grail.

 

[Dr. Purpur]

I bought Toms seeds. all three strains. I did not grow the haze seeds because I heard later there was catpiss smells in it, and odds of keepers are low +-(5%).
The Deep Chunk while looks nice and is dense bud, all of mine had flavors I didnt like, and some of them gave me headaches.

 

[Donald Mallard]

Hi dr purp ,
sounds like a taste id enjoy , i used to love the flavour of that hash ..


Hi josh ,, on the deep chunk , it really shines in hybrids , i did find the pure version mediocre tokewise ,
but some hybrids we have made from it had something very special ,
i should think the deep chunk x his haze would be well worth growing ..

 

[bigherb]

I bought Toms seeds. all three strains. I did not grow the haze seeds because I heard later there was catpiss smells in it, and odds of keepers are low +-(5%).
The Deep Chunk while looks nice and is dense bud, all of mine had flavors I didnt like, and some of them gave me headaches.

All 3 would that include X18 ?

IME the tora bora i grew out was a grease bomb hashplant .I think the X18 could have great breeding potential

I dont recall a report with catpiss in tom's haze ,IMO its atrait that associate with haze and welcome with open arms.But ive heard some graet things about the line aswell as many of the colombian traits present in this recent stock


1luvbigherb

 

[bushweed]

I agree the common denominator is probably Thai, but it just may be other things as well.

Agreed. I remember DJ Short reporting that both Hawaiian and Colombian genetics didn't reproduce the electric high they were famous for when grown in the States. He did however, state that Mexican strains did translate well in US soil. The implication was that Colombian and Hawaiian genetics weren't that hot, but growing them in volcanic soil in an equatorial climate, invariably produced strong dope (thus supporting the nurture over nature argument). Mexican on the other hand were genuinely superior genetics.

So everyone gets hot for Colombian genes in regard to Haze, but perhaps the Mexican genes were equally influential.

Interesting that both Sam and Nevil report that the best landraces they've encountered are/were Thai.

I bought Toms seeds. all three strains. I did not grow the haze seeds because I heard later there was catpiss smells in it, and odds of keepers are low +-(5%).

Cat piss in OHaze - god forbid that piece of info's going to require another chapter of speculation when whoever finally issues the next Haze article.

bh, b_h, and jessE, who? will be typing away furiously as we speak...

 

[bushweed]

If Tom's Haze is what its purported to be, then the 5% hit rate should increase markedly when hybridized, because as Sam states - true Haze is much superior when hybridized.

I have suggested many times that Original Haze is "breeding material" not great commercial growing materials, but you seem to only notice what you want to notice.

That Nevil's Haze hybrids have earned such high regard confirms this.

 

[hempy]

The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 10 characters.

 

[bushweed]

Its interesting that on this map the pink zone extends up to the 30 degree mark in the northern hemisphere (Florida, Nepal), but only down to the 15 degree mark in the southern hemisphere (NT, Australia). So in reality, the pink zone can extend another fifteen hundred kilometers in the south.

 

[joshuahazen]

Hi josh ,, on the deep chunk , it really shines in hybrids , i did find the pure version mediocre tokewise ,
but some hybrids we have made from it had something very special ,
i should think the deep chunk x his haze would be well worth growing ..

Well I'm glad to hear you got something good from it. I am way to backlogged with all kinds of crazy shit to take on any new projects. MNS is the only thing on the wish list(NH, NL5hz, Nina, Craze) right now. I have to admit though, that Z99 is also intriguing. It has 5hz in it somewhere.

Agreed. I remember DJ Short reporting that both Hawaiian and Colombian genetics didn't reproduce the electric high they were famous for when grown in the States. He did however, state that Mexican strains did translate well in US soil. The implication was that Colombian and Hawaiian genetics weren't that hot, but growing them in volcanic soil in an equatorial climate, invariably produced strong dope (thus supporting the nurture over nature argument). Mexican on the other hand were genuinely superior genetics.

So everyone gets hot for Colombian genes in regard to Haze, but perhaps the Mexican genes were equally influential.

Interesting that both Sam and Nevil report that the best landraces they've encountered are/were Thai.



Cat piss in OHaze - god forbid that piece of info's going to require another chapter of speculation when whoever finally issues the next Haze article.

bh, b_h, and jessE, who? will be typing away furiously as we speak...

Yeah I agree. The best landraces I have ever tried were Thai, and some African was right up there as well, Some varieties of Durban, and the one Malawi I've tried. But No landrace quite compares to that original NL5Hz cut I used to have, in fact I have never tried anything that does, although some of her progeny has come close.

I would so much like to try the MM, I wonder what the lineage of it is, in terms of landraces. I know it is predominantly Thai, but judging from the pics I've seen on this thread, it has some other profound and huge, fat, stuff in it as well.

 

[jack hairy]

yeah, if something really special comes from this project, we should take a lesson from the past and ensure that we can never lose it like others.
if mm is going to be in the grail, how can we secure a stable supply of them?
same for the mex27 and oaxacan and any other contenders.
nevil will surely come up with the best they have to offer, but some people might want to play around and make their own version, or go another route using a different combination of the same genetics.
I would love to get some pure mm seeds
i know it might be a lot of work, but maybe mns could release a parent line of all the grail parents along with the release of the grail.

 

[Donald Mallard]

Donald the out door plants were grown on the north coast and not in a temperate zone mate and the sativas i grew out doors are still spoken about in my circle of friends and family as hard as it is for some of you to believe i know my art and know it very well.

Thailand has temperate zones to by the way.

If you honestly think that only the tropics will produce the best weed well mate you have not smoked quality from places like SA Vic or NSW then.

I dont doubt its good erbs hempy ,
ive lived in melbourne and about , i know the quality of the erb and have grown down south .. and have toked herb up and down the coast since young ..

the best place for a plant that is adapt to a particular enviroment is grow it there , then you can realise the full potential , thats all its about ...

not that a replicated environment wont produce good erb also ,
just not its full potential ..

 

[bushweed]

some people might want to play around and make their own version, or go another route using a different combination of the same genetics.
I would love to get some pure mm seeds
i know it might be a lot of work, but maybe mns could release a parent line of all the grail parents along with the release of the grail.

It would be nice.... but its hard to make a buck as a seed seller, and its a lot of work (sourcing, growing, selecting, preserving, avoiding the law), and if Nev and Kanga released the Oaxacan and MM as pure strains, they'd quickly be copied and flogged off and their market would be diminished, so in reality the pure MM or Oaxacan will never be sold....

 

[joshuahazen]

Yeah, I think most of us will benefit more from the hybrids that they produce.
A breeder is always going to guard his parent strains, this is true in all plant breeders, not just those who breed our unique plant. I trust Nevil will do a better job creating a final product with those parents then most of us could even dream of. I would rather let him do all the hard word and benefit from his special form of Genius. Just because you have all the ingredients that the master chef has, does not mean you will be able to bake the same cake.

Personally, I have got my eyes on the Grail.

 

[jack hairy]

would you want to buy ripoff seeds or get them from the source? mns would always be the top dog

maybe someone else could do something with the mm that could create something better than the grail, should we be deprived of that if it happened?
i think nevil would be secure in his skills that none could do much better, so what would come of others working the parent lines? inferior genetics,

 

[PondeLftHndSide]

Even if they were released pure, I'll bet you couldn't even give the parent lines to 90% of the growers here in California these days... so many bandwagon cashcrop newbies who got into growing first and foremost to make a buck, who understand complex hydro systems and light chillers and fan relays all day long but had their first toke in 2002 and have no idea what came before. That dank mersh Indica that pinned them to the sofa WAS their old-school memory, not some spicy, wispy import that set their 3rd eye alight. This is not the Grail market, they could give a fuck. But they runnin' things here in Cali now. I've been trying to pass on some of my best cuttings and seeds for years, for free even, and hardly anybody wants them. Won't fit into their 2lbs per light in 8 weeks strategy.

I think anyone who is even interested in the parent lines being discussed here is pretty much a 1%'er in this day and age, and I'm willing to bet that a sizeable chunk of that 1% would use them quite wisely. I know I would. And most likely, nobody would care about or enjoy the progeny but me and mine. But I'm more than happy to wait and let Nevil and Co. do the hard work for me in this case. I've got plenty of pure lines to sift through already that will keep me busy for years.

 

[bigherb]

Something just didn't seem quite right about what you were saying and I couldn't quite put my finger on it.
But Now I understand what you are saying, and frankly your revisionist version of haze history just doesn't cut it.

We were talking about NYC Haze, which according to you, your cousin first came across in NY in 90, just a year before it showed up in NYC.

Positronics didn't even start selling haze until early 90s and Tom Hill didn't get it until 94, anyway Positronics OHAZE was way after NYC haze, and by the way, the only source ever shipping 1000s of haze seeds to NY Between 88 and 90 was the Seedbank. Now why did haze start showing up in NYC between 90 and 91?

Oh it must have been Positronics OHAZE because as all of us know Tom Wernard and Sam got together at Hortapharm and built a fucking time machine! OH YEAH.... I forgot about that.

And besides Positronics haze was not the cats meow, even Tom Hill agrees with that. Shit, he is more into his deep chunk which is also mediocre at best.

Time for you to own up and recognize, cause history is truth my friend and you can't revise that.

Not sure why my opinion means soo much to you we had this discussion already there is nothin more to add ,I dont wish to continue on but will say this again

AS i first stated thoughts and possibility ,I lay no claim to fact or proof .Im saying what i find is most probable as anything is possible AND YOU SOON WILL UNDERSTAND MORE AS THEY GOOD THINGS COME TO THOSE WHO WAIT.

On the haze subject i wanted to share this post n quote which was another factor in my thoughts of several correlations


NL5hz/NL1hz/silver haze /posi Ohaze of late 80's - 90'S ASWELL as the pure sativa imports that came threw NYC are all possible lineage to our nyc haze n hybrids.I cant find it but sure i will some day soon its only one man experience/word but if i recall he stated he experienced Nyc haze before the SB release dates ,aside from this My older cousin smoked Frank for his fist time in 90 ,Some more food for thought to my thought on the possibility hmm hmmm possibility that a pure haze exist in nyc .Here the post i said i would find.Thanks Baphomet

Originally Posted by The Baphomet
bigherb, I received 6 cuts of the church around 94 and ran her for a few years at a few different locations and lost her around 97-98 . The cut was given to me by commercial grower friend who couldn't run her because of the long flowering cycle and he was running faster finishing $tuff , he never told me where he got it from and I never bothered to ask .
As for the origin of the church I have no idea ,all I now is that it was a haze . The first time I smoked it was around 85-86 and it was from a spot in Harlem

THE FACT WILL NEVER BE KNOWN AS TO THE LINEAGE OF NYC HAZE and i have no desire to change that .

In case you didnt know Tomhill haze is from posi ,soo im not sure what you are sayin in your comment.
Is this a fact posi shipped seed to the states in 90 ?


1luvbigherb

 

[joshuahazen]

would you want to buy ripoff seeds or get them from the source? mns would always be the top dog

maybe someone else could do something with the mm that could create something better than the grail, should we be deprived of that if it happened?
i think nevil would be secure in his skills that none could do much better, so what would come of others working the parent lines? inferior genetics,

Jack, Jack,Jack.....(sigh)



You know the story about the dog who had a bone? He was walking across the bridge and he paused and peered down at his reflection in the water in the stream beneath the bridge, and when he did, he saw what appeared to be another dog with a bone. The dog got it in his greedy little mind that maybe he could get 2 bones instead of just one, so he Barked at this other dog, and when he openned his mouth to bark, guess what happenned? The bone fell out of his mouth into the stream and was lost to the stupid little dog forever.


You remind me of this little dog Jack, the only difference is, you don't even have the bone yet and already you are barking at reflections. Even the damn dog wasn't that stupid.

Relax dude, someone is trying to do us all a favor and you are already whining. What is wrong with you?

 

[joshuahazen]

Not sure why my opinion means soo much to you...

1luvbigherb

Because I like you Bigherb.

You just happen to be full of shit on this one.

I'm trying to help you.

You are trying to get back to that NYC Haze flavor, well you are looking in the wrong place.

We can't know anything for certain, the best we can do is make an educated guess, in science we refer to this as a Hypothesis.

Let me spell it out for you:

N-E-V-I-L-L-E-'-S H-A-Z-E
Shanti's New NL5Haze would be a good bet as well.

 

[bigherb]

Because I like you Bigherb.

You just happen to be full of shit on this one.

I'm trying to help you.

You are trying to get back to that NYC Haze flavor, well you are looking in the wrong place.

We can't know anything for certain, the best we can do is make an educated guess, in science we refer to this as a Hypothesis.

Let me spell it out for you:

N-E-V-I-L-L-E-'-S H-A-Z-E
Shanti's New NL5Haze would be a good bet as well.

How nice everyone has been trying to help ,Remember that sayin you can help someone till you can help yourself and you my friend have been growing Nevil's original haze that never existed


Im really not sure why you have acted in this manner ,We've never had any issues.How can i be full of shit on my opinon thats all it is, on top of that i give you a post from a member at IC which gives pre seed bank dates are you implying i created that post

I think i should start a thread for some of you

MNS fam would you call this Relating hating or disrespecting ?

Lookin in the wrong place ,Ive been here at mns for somtime exactly because of the traits of taste/aromas.Which Im most thankful UNC
L33T brought to my attention .Ive grwon NH ive grown Sk/HZ and i said since my first taste i can see a relation .

 

[jack hairy]

Jack, Jack,Jack.....(sigh)



You know the story about the dog who had a bone? He was walking across the bridge and he paused and peered down at his reflection in the water in the stream beneath the bridge, and when he did, he saw what appeared to be another dog with a bone. The dog got it in his greedy little mind that maybe he could get 2 bones instead of just one, so he Barked at this other dog, and when he openned his mouth to bark, guess what happenned? The bone fell out of his mouth into the stream and was lost to the stupid little dog forever.


You remind me of this little dog Jack, the only difference is, you don't even have the bone yet and already you are barking at reflections. Even the damn dog wasn't that stupid.

Relax dude, someone is trying to do us all a favor and you are already whining. What is wrong with you?

what is wrong with you? maybe you are stupid.
nice little story, but how does that relate? by trying to get the parents, i wont have the opportunity to get the grail? shit down and shut up, learn from history
other great things could be made other than what becomes the grail, are you that shortsighted

You have it wrong, i am the pitbull, waiting to tear into the cow out in the field