NHS genetics.

Vlad the Inhaler

Active member
Hello everyone. I hope some others are able to add a bit to this thread.
On the surface this line may seem a bit ho-hum. NL5*hzC\skunk#1.
But a bit of research reveals an excellent selection.
The father goes a long way back, and is real cannabis royalty.
The mother was one of Mr Nice''s early works.
She supposedly grows well in veg, and runs amok in flowering. A real impressive plant.
The strain offers a nice wide genetic spread, and appears to be a real underappreciated gem.
I recommend this line to everyone I know, growing outdoors here in Western Australia, if they have the room, or inside if they feel up to it.
Does anyone have more information on either of the parents? And can add a bit of insight, please.
I'd love a bit more input on this fantastic line.
 
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Vlad the Inhaler

Active member
Just read megawatts thread on these.
He had them go 2-1/2 to 4-1/2 pound each.
The father was a '88 skunk from Rob Clarke. From a handful of seeds he handed to Shanti, as something special he had been working on.
I'm only getting this from browsing threads, though.
Anyone with a bit more personal knowledge on this lines parents? Please.
 

Amoril

New member
Just read megawatts thread on these.
He had them go 2-1/2 to 4-1/2 pound each.
The father was a '88 skunk from Rob Clarke. From a handful of seeds he handed to Shanti, as something special he had been working on.
I'm only getting this from browsing threads, though.
Anyone with a bit more personal knowledge on this lines parents? Please.

I'd always thought the father was an afghan skunk male (maybe skunk#1 pheno?)

Mainly because it was done about the same time as angel heart and nevilles skunk, which also use the af/skunk pops
 

Reason

New member
My N.H.S. Pack from the auctions I got in 2018 came to me labeled as “NL5/Hz x Afg/Sk”. I’ve also read the story about the 1988 seed stock. I’d say it’s likely the same father as the the other Afg/Sk hybrids and that selection was from Nevil made seeds from 1988.

The first Super Skunk showed up in the ‘88 or ‘89 catalogues.

Curiously, the NL5 x Afghan also uses an Afg/Sk male, though it doesn’t come listed on the pack, but in the pedigree as 75% Afghan and 25% Skunk.

As much as my heart aches for Nevil’s passing as I had real hopes that he would eventually re-emerge to the scene, I’m hoping for whatever non disclosure agreement they had after 2012 when things got weird—people getting banned, posts deleted, Shanti hardly responding to questions and being misleading about pedigree information—will finally end and Shanti will be a bit more generous with his time and knowledge. He isn’t exactly a spring chicken after all, either. Would probably be a great time to expound his experiences upon his loyal fan base.

Not even for free... hell, write a book, Scott, I’ll buy three copies... preorder, even.
 
well shanti thinks its no one elses business, but nevil didn feel that way.
nevil told me he never got paid for anything for mns, that is why he was upset.

nevil could have used the money for his health struggles. maybe he wouldnt have passed if he was able to get the care he needed.

i didnt ask what exactly was the deal they had worked out, so i dont know where/why the arrangement was broken.

something is really messed up there, on one hand shanti acts like he and nevil were best friends, and maybe they were at some point, but i know nevil was not happy with shanti towards the end, thats for sure.
and it wasnt for no reason.
i dont think there was any non disclosure agreement, that would require a legal footing.
as what they were doing is mostly illegal, you cant go to court for it.
otherwise nevil would have taken shanti to court for the money he owed him.
or nevil felt he was owed.
not knowing the details, its hard to say.
 

PlantManBee

Well-known member
Believing one side of an argument and discounting the other is a sure way to ignore any truth in there in my opinion.

If you don't think that Neville got a marketing boost from MNS... well, we don't agree. I'm quite certain that everyone involved has made incorrect statements as to lineage.

It is about selection in the long run.
 

Reason

New member
It is about selection in the long run.
For the end-use purpose of finding a quality clone mother for personal smoke or production crops, I couldn’t agree more. It really doesn’t even matter what the hell its background genetics are at that point. All the most hyped up strains are the most mysterious... and I don’t think that’s an accident, people are intrigued by mystery. I certainly am.

But ask any serious dog owner if they care about pedigree and I’m certain their answer will be different. Ask any serious dog breeder if pedigree is important...

In the end, to me, it isn’t even about what someone wishes to do with the information, especially when Shanti himself has said numerous times that it doesn’t matter what steps they took in their breeding, replicating their work isn’t as easy as “mix this strain and that strain” and you’re done. It would take the same numbers and selection they have applied to their efforts. Anyone can buy Afghan Haze seeds, select a male and “replicate” some of the modern MNS strains, but they’d never be the same as what ShantiÂ’s male produces. His ability to run large numbers of progeny give him the upper hand in selection.

What it’s all about, really, is that this is an illegal practice in most countries. This is a major risk for many customers that make the lifestyle these breeders take for granted possible in the first place. I just don’t think it’s asking too much for, over the course of nearly two decades, updates to some basic strain information. Especially when in America it’s become the norm to disclose heritage and hunt down mysteries as opposed to the classic Dutch and Spanish practices of hiding your “proprietary” magic blends.

Hell, Scott’s a busy, busy man. Shoot me an email with the appropriate information and I’ll donate my own time and effort (what should amount to all of one, maybe two hours) and personally update all the strain descriptions so that he doesn’t have to waste the equivalent of a decent smoke-sesh doing it himself.

It just all gets silly after a while.
 
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i also agree with just finding something good and it doesnt matter what the name is.

however, in order to find that "something good" i am trying to work backwards from a source i know that had the traits/quality im searching for.
sounds reasonable, no?

so i had one plant from bagseed, no name. it had this type of smell/trait/quality
then i grew a jack herer and recognized right away the same overall smell/trait/quality, yet it was different.

so finding out that what im looking for might be in haze, thats where im looking.
so knowing the pedigree of plants can help avoid searching in places that will lead me to come up empty.

again, its all just names, so why should anyone be so worried about giving out names?
we just want the names as markers to what came before, and where it might go.

what happens if/when (heaven forbid) shanti dies?
if he does not put this information out there, it may be lost forever.
considering the spread of his genetics, that would leave a lot of holes in the lineage of future cannabis strains.
who would want that to happen.

maybe in the future it could all be sorted easily with dna tests, unlike what phylos is doing.
 

Reason

New member
what happens if/when (heaven forbid) shanti dies?
if he does not put this information out there, it may be lost forever.
That’s my biggest fear.

Having a sizable collection of his genetics (who’s labels don’t match the site description in some cases) and finding it so difficult to communicate when so many other breeders have opened their doors and experiences really puts off my plans to incorporate them into my personal programs. I have regular conversations with Bodhi, Mr. Hemphill, Caleb from CSI—among others—about their genetic heritage and how best to use their gear.

It seems that old Dutch mentality dies hard. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
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yes, a (nl5 x nl5 haze C) x skunk would come in at different ratios than stated in the strain description.

is this another error?
 

Vlad the Inhaler

Active member
MNS don't have any F1 haze breeding females left.
They also bred the hz c male over nl first.
So nl5)(nl5/hzC, Nl5/c5 or *nl/hzC* are all the same thing.

If I could find the post from Shanti talking about f1 hybrids of NL 5 n haze in breeding, I'd be laughing.
Its same one he discussed working hz A over hz C.
Would love to find the info on the RC skunk as well.
NHS isn't a nordle or super skunk.cross.
 
i doubt thats true. you think they dont have C5, an f1 haze female? or A5 mother of NH? or skunk haze A father of MH etc...
not sure what youre trying to say.
f1's are the hybrids, maybe p1's are what you mean?
if so, mns never had p1 haze females to breed, only haze c male

but to me, nl5)(nl5/hzC, Nl5/c5 or *nl/hzC* are not all the same thing.

well maybe the first two are, but they dont even make sense.
which one was the male, NL5 or C5? they didnt do fems back then.

nl/hzC could be a different northern lights like #1
 
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Vlad the Inhaler

Active member
NL5/hzC
NL5/C5
NL5)(NL5/hzC

All the same if they put the pure haze male over the NL5 and then selected breeding males.

I've got no way to know if Shanti has what original stock alive

But I'll ask you something.

The latest breeding uses either AB male, which is clearly not as potent as the straight hz C breeding.
Or his excellent affy/haze C male.

Shanti's MM with either the A or C male.

C5#122 with the pure A male? ( a new nev's utilising one of Shanti's fave mum.)

They are two examples you could ( would? ).produce if you were able to.
How may people have requested that breeding over the years?

His new G13 with either of the pure haze.

I'm not saying definitely anything, I don't know.

Shanti says that no-one received any of their breeding stock.
The cops busted their breeding room along the way.
Nev goes to gaol.
Shanti moves to Switzerland, to breed for terpene collection, before being busted.
Then time is Spain.

What do you reckon?
 

Vlad the Inhaler

Active member
The reason why you would tame the hz C male by selecting a nl5/hz C male (c5 male) is obvious.
You would have a spread of 8-16weeks if you used the pure haze male in hybrids.
The NL 5 accepted haze really well.
It didn't dominate the breeding.
It increases yield, shortened bloom times, and maxed out resin.

The lines are very homoginous for 4 way hybrids.(ssh say)

Nl5*NL5/hzc)(NL5/hzc*skunk would tie you in around 9 (8-12))weeks, depending on your selections.

NL5/pure Haze C)(skunk/pure haze C would easily spread 8-16 weeks , if you were doing a 4 way, with two f1's.

How long does your supposed related old timer haze take to bloom?
 
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Vlad the Inhaler

Active member
i doubt thats true. you think they dont have C5, an f1 haze female? or A5 mother of NH? or skunk haze A father of MH etc...
not sure what youre trying to say.
f1's are the hybrids, maybe p1's are what you mean?
if so, mns never had p1 haze females to breed, only haze c male

but to me, nl5)(nl5/hzC, Nl5/c5 or *nl/hzC* are not all the same thing.

well maybe the first two are, but they dont even make sense.
which one was the male, NL5 or C5? they didnt do fems back then.

nl/hzC could be a different northern lights like #1
What I am saying is they don't have any f1.
The true f1 nl5/hzC was release in 1989.
It made people shit their pants.

I think the C5 they use, like #122 mango are actually
NL5)(NL5/hz C.

So a release of NL/HZ would look something like
NL5*NL5/hzC. Selecting a nl/hz male for early maturity and tight flower structure.
 
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Old Spice

New member
MNS don't have any F1 haze breeding females left.
They also bred the hz c male over nl first.
So nl5)(nl5/hzC, Nl5/c5 or *nl/hzC* are all the same thing.

If I could find the post from Shanti talking about f1 hybrids of NL 5 n haze in breeding, I'd be laughing.
Its same one he discussed working hz A over hz C.
Would love to find the info on the RC skunk as well.
NHS isn't a nordle or super skunk.cross.
Shanti never posted anything about the "New Skunk" coming from RCC. That was in a PM to another member, then shared between members. You are passing off second hand info as facts from Shanti. Gotta be careful about that . . . filling in blanks.

MNS skunk line was crossed with Afghani #1 in the early Seedbank days by Nevil, then crossed back to skunk#1.
It's in the catalogs. That is why "Shit" is superior to all that generic "skunk #1" but some of the old hybrid parent stock might still include pure skunk#1.

I'm not sure what the timeline is for when NHS was created.
Based on when Shanti made it would be the best indcator of whether it uses the afghan skunk male or a shit selection.
It's possible the whole hybrid was already done by Nevil and Shanti just took it out a few Filial generations . . . just saying.

There's no indication anywhere that Shanti ever released a cross inlcuding "New Skunk" as a parent. I think it's cool that he released it from his vault though.

Hey Vlad, why don't you spend a few minutes and find this thread you say you read with info from Shanti about his NL5/Haze C selection/breeding and share it?
It's been years since I've seen Shanti say anything about NL5C and he didn't say what you said . . . at all.
 

Vlad the Inhaler

Active member
Shanti never posted anything about the "New Skunk" coming from RCC. That was in a PM to another member, then shared between members. You are passing off second hand info as facts from Shanti. Gotta be careful about that . . . filling in blanks.

MNS skunk line was crossed with Afghani #1 in the early Seedbank days by Nevil, then crossed back to skunk#1.
It's in the catalogs. That is why "Shit" is superior to all that generic "skunk #1" but some of the old hybrid parent stock might still include pure skunk#1.

I'm not sure what the timeline is for when NHS was created.
Based on when Shanti made it would be the best indcator of whether it uses the afghan skunk male or a shit selection.
It's possible the whole hybrid was already done by Nevil and Shanti just took it out a few Filial generations . . . just saying.

There's no indication anywhere that Shanti ever released a cross inlcuding "New Skunk" as a parent. I think it's cool that he released it from his vault though.

Hey Vlad, why don't you spend a few minutes and find this thread you say you read with info from Shanti about his NL5/Haze C selection/breeding and share it?
It's been years since I've seen Shanti say anything about NL5C and he didn't say what you said . . . at all.
Lol at you , twisting my words.

I say I don't really know, I wish someone would help out.

I have a dopers memory, so I say I'm kind of struggling.

Instead of turning everything into a pissing contest why don't you assist other members, or visitors considering buying this product, by telling us all what you actually know??

You are no less a snarky troublemaker than your two maladjusted friends.
 

Vlad the Inhaler

Active member
Hey old spice, cos you not here to help further the thread. But apparently for griefing, just a quick question please?
Are you an alt account of EB?

I've noticed over the years, when EB acts the fool, and gets called out, or just basically wears out his welcome, then you start posting.
He goes to the chiller, then you fire up.
I've even seen you two leap frog each other while making grief.

So it's not unreasonable to ask are you an alt of that maladjusted shit head??
 
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