90s NL5 x Haze USA Version. AKA. The Cough

iisfinxii

New member
I never did find a cut of the Cough. One of the few cuts I'd actually like to have. The bit about it being NL5 x Haze #19 sets off my BS detector...like Sam and his nut-sack swingers trying to re-write history again.
We were always told it was simply NL5 x HAZE, and it’s was crossed in Fort Collins and not from the nl5xhaxe the seedbanks sell. West word a newspaper/magazine did an article on it a few years back and they were the ones who traced it back to a supposed haze 17. There was also a very popular version of it in Fort Collins called the Nough it was the cough crossed with Northern lights again. Mine I have now is very similar to that cross as is really brought out the very desirable cough traits more. I’ll downsize a picture and post it. The rosin and flower off the Cough resembles nothing I’ve ever come across again.
 

iisfinxii

New member
there is a little bit that seems to get left out of this story and the other genetics that came from Fort Collins at that time. During this period CSU was one of the top agricultural schools out there and that attracted people that wanted to learn how to grow and it also attracted people that wanted to grow cannabis. looking back there was a long time where local strains in FOCO were highly sought after elsewhere because they were only there. There was a group of growers and breeders that worked with one another that The Cough, LGS, FOCO Blueberry, Nough and a few other were all part of this group of growers. I just happened to be lucky enough to know 2 of those growers. The had what they called the Bible and would only share the genetics if you paid dues back to them and they would also set up your grow and then you owed them 50% of the grows for the first year. it was like a mob. every one of their grows was a Multiflow system setup, whats funny is I always told them to pound sand on their "Deal" but over time was shared with none the less. I still to this day feel that the multi flow system is by fay the best and they were on to that in like 1999
 

iisfinxii

New member
here you go a real cough this was crossed with Legend OG then basically pheno hunted out the OG and this is just Cough at this point. That way I was able to bring it back to seed from clone only and not feminized for future crosses. The Original was a bit more dark green with more mean red hairs. As I said above this one brings out all the good, it gets bigger and more trichome covered but retains all the terpenes of the mother (Cough) its also a little fluffier than the original and I like that as well as it really does produce.IMG_4594.jpg
 
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axiom

MNS Award Winner
It’s always a tough sell for me when special haze hybrids emerge from a clouded past claiming to be unrelated to Nevils work.
History lesson
1987 was the year I first heard of Haze
It’s also the first time I ever heard of Northern Lights
Both In Nevils Seed Bank Catalog
It was also the first time I realized there was a Specific Plant called Skunk1 not just a stinky smelling pot plant.
Bottom Line
You would be damn rare if you had good strong drug cannabis plants or seeds that didn’t have at least one line back to Nevils original work.
Strawberry cough was brought to me from Colorado in 2001 from Fort Collins. I wasn’t really impressed so I gave the guy a SSH catpiss to take back with him.
Use that instead I said.
History lesson over.
So to wrap my second rant of the day up.
You cannot change history but you can change the future.🤔
✌
 

iisfinxii

New member
Well all I can say is I have had this cut of cough for 21 years and I got it from the group I referenced. Never once during my time in foco or around all the growers that had the cough before me did they ever reference Nevel or any seed bank for that matter.
me personally would love it if it was simply the NL5xhaze they sell and at one point this pheno could have come from that. But I have sprouted many nl5xhaze seeds over the years and they have been similar to the cough but missing something. Again the Nough was also backwards bred with the same northerlights the cough was which would hint that they did in fact make the cross them selves. I’m not here to argue being that I’m the one that has it and likely knows the back story over everyone who doesn’t have it. My story is what was directly told to me by the growers that had the original cough in FOCO in 2001. My story is what all my friends stories would be from foco from that time and believe me we were very prominent players in the industry at that time.
What I am willing to do rather than nay say and act like I know the truth over anyone else and push that thought process aside as where it came from and how we got here is irrelevant. What I’m wanting to do…..
I’m willing to make some feminized seeds from my cough female and share them with you guys if you would still like to aquire a real Cough genetic.
Calling me a liar won’t earn brownie points lol as I have nothing to lie about. I gain noting no popularity or anything by fabricating cannabis stories. As I was telling the history I realized how outlandish it sounded but that’s how it went down and that’s how these guys did things and they ran the foco cannabis industry at that time. They would sell their “grow bible” for 500-1000$ and to be able to buy it you had to do their deal and let them set up your grow and then you grew their genetics and after a year you could keep the genetics and it would all be yours.
I don’t have cough in my next run as I cycle through my girls a bit but I can put it in the next one down the line and spray it with silver and get some seeds and come back here and send them to who wants them. I’m all honestly i hated the way those growers would bogart knowledge and genetics and I have always used that as a way to do the exact opposite. If anyone is in Colorado I would gladly share a bug free clone with them. 21+ of corse gotta follow those laws lol.


Those growers are real not just a story, how they did things is also real as I still use some of their grow tactics and styles to this day.
 
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musashi

Site Moderator
Staff member
Hey brah!
We do not solicit or trade seeds overtly on this site. Please familiarize yourself with the house rules.
We are a jaded group here having heard so many stories before of the "One" that has been miraculously resurrected from the past and it is always touted as the original and the best, better than anything else out there ;)
I will not dispute your belief but as I cannot verify your story as I was not there, my question is why would I want fem seeds not certain of their origination when I can get regular, bonified NL5/Hz seeds from MrNice?

🤙mu
 

iisfinxii

New member
Hey brah!
We do not solicit or trade seeds overtly on this site. Please familiarize yourself with the house rules.
We are a jaded group here having heard so many stories before of the "One" that has been miraculously resurrected from the past and it is always touted as the original and the best, better than anything else out there ;)
I will not dispute your belief but as I cannot verify your story as I was not there, my question is why would I want fem seeds not certain of its origination when I can get regular, bonified NL5/Hz seeds from MrNice?

🤙mu
well as if you read above I didnt offer to trade or sell I offered to give away. Also go ahead and try the NL5xHaze seeds. they wont give you cough, many many locals have tried including myself especially after I crossed it to get it back to seed. I dont have any males right now that would be a good fit for this genetic to cross to make regs. My story and the one thats on dynasty genetics page arent very different from one another, both say this wasnt from the nl5xhaze seeds from Mr Nice seedsbank, because it wasnt. Again I have nothin to prove and dont give a shit if you buy my story, Because at the end of the day Ive had this amazing strain for many years and it wont be replicated from mr nice seeds or more colorado dispensaries would carry it. simple as that. I ran a professional grow facility for 3 years and during that time we tried many nl5xhaze seed packs and pheno hunted and they simply werent cough. if you were able to come visit I could sit you down with several colorodans who would have the same history of this strain as my self as Im not the only one who was gifted it by the same growers I was at that time and im still very good friends with those guys, Im the only one who held onto the cough through the years and cherished it.

Be my guest and buy NL5xHaze from Mr nice and call it cough, but all you will be doing is seling a lie lol.
 

iisfinxii

New member
And just to set it straight mine hasn't been miraculously resurrected from anywhere, Im just new to this forum and found this while looking up strawberry cough as thats likely the coughs next cross for me. That or Showboat (archive seed bank). This is the story of our cough since 2001 and then it was ours and we even had it on our menu at our dispensary at the time Medicine Man Medical Market, was the name of the dispensary. it is now held exclusively to me. I do have seeds of my cross that come out of that warehouse that are regs but im not parting ways with a single one, sorry!
 

Marcus_in_the_Darkus

Well-known member
First, I think someone should talk to Shanti about the house rules, as I feel the sharing of genetics among forum members should be encouraged, especially considering how many members reside in areas where weed is now legal.

@iisfinxii, I'm not accusing you of being a liar, and I appreciate your perspective on the cough. But Occam's razor tells me the simplest explanation is the one most likely to be true. The Fort Collins cough showed up in the 1990s, about 10 years after Nevil opened the seed bank and many, many thousand NL5Hz of seeds had been shipped to many growers in the US who grew them out and found some excellent plants. Same decade as piff showed up in NYC. The simple answer is the cough is from Dutch stock. Was Haze 17 even available in the US? I thought it was selected in Holland by Sam. Or is that Haze 19? I just think the Dutch Nl5Hz connection is much simpler to explain that breeders in Colorado sourcing the same NL genetics that Nevil used, and then crossing with a haze cut from Sam. ALas, nobody will ever know for sure.

Also, while I'd like to have a genuine F1 Nl5Hz cut, I wouldn't be interested in one that was crossed to an OG and then subsequently had the OG bred out of it. I'm not trying to disparage your weed, just stating why an honest-to-God F1 Nl5Hz cut would be preferable to a haze lover over one that has been outcrossed to an Indica and bred all over the map.

All that said, do you know if the original Colorado Cough can be found? I recall reading here at MNS that a member found the cough in a Colorado dispensary within the last 10 years.
 

dingo

Member
well as if you read above I didnt offer to trade or sell I offered to give away. Also go ahead and try the NL5xHaze seeds. they wont give you cough
it just sounds like you're selling something. they say the best salesmen are true believers.

"There's a sucker born every minute"
This was also positronics haze:
everyone should have total confidence in anyone offering "lambsbreath" seed, it's a sure sign that they know what they're talking about.

let's play the numbers game! (attachment)

no one was growing haze in the 80's unless it was derived from Cultivators Choice/Sacred Seeds genetics (Dutch). "Sam" and his catalog claims that he only sold within Holland. if anyone else was growing haze from old seeds, they didn't know it as haze and had no nl access anyways.

the only likely explanation is that the cut was from seed obtained by mail in 87-89, my guess is a CSU student with 1000 watts, who retailed to other CSU students.

even in this millennium (the Trash Age) it was possible to get nlh phenos that smell like the old description attached but smoke like black pepper. as the fall 85 o haze catalog entry says: "10% are spectacular". which in my limited experience is a better rate than hazeless seed.

i've grown sativa nlh pheno (not mns sorry) with different males and had some females (not more than 25% of course) come out very close to the mother. some strains overpower the haze in every way, some don't.
 

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iisfinxii

New member
First, I think someone should talk to Shanti about the house rules, as I feel the sharing of genetics among forum members should be encouraged, especially considering how many members reside in areas where weed is now legal.

@iisfinxii, I'm not accusing you of being a liar, and I appreciate your perspective on the cough. But Occam's razor tells me the simplest explanation is the one most likely to be true. The Fort Collins cough showed up in the 1990s, about 10 years after Nevil opened the seed bank and many, many thousand NL5Hz of seeds had been shipped to many growers in the US who grew them out and found some excellent plants. Same decade as piff showed up in NYC. The simple answer is the cough is from Dutch stock. Was Haze 17 even available in the US? I thought it was selected in Holland by Sam. Or is that Haze 19? I just think the Dutch Nl5Hz connection is much simpler to explain that breeders in Colorado sourcing the same NL genetics that Nevil used, and then crossing with a haze cut from Sam. ALas, nobody will ever know for sure.

Also, while I'd like to have a genuine F1 Nl5Hz cut, I wouldn't be interested in one that was crossed to an OG and then subsequently had the OG bred out of it. I'm not trying to disparage your weed, just stating why an honest-to-God F1 Nl5Hz cut would be preferable to a haze lover over one that has been outcrossed to an Indica and bred all over the map.

All that said, do you know if the original Colorado Cough can be found? I recall reading here at MNS that a member found the cough in a Colorado dispensary within the last 10 years.
Well the one I have is what you want then as it’s only got the haze traits. Cough is the strongest haze strain I’ve come across so everything you cross it with will be hazy very hazy. Sadly out of the people I knew with the cough, I’m the only one that was smart enough to bring it back to seed and didn’t lose it completely. Until this forum I didn’t even know anyone else had ever bred it. I don’t frequent dispos as the weed is almost always dogshit.
I get that mine won’t be a F1 or regs but you would be able to experience the cough and enjoy it. It’s truly the best strain I have an I have some of the very best in my opinion. I have several Archive and Raredankness genetics and Greenpoint and Twenty20’s arcata Trainwreck and I would take cough over them all if I had to pick. If I’m being totally honest I would take my cough over the original also. It will take me like 3 months to get some cough back in a flower run and have cough seeds available, but even for myself I’m going to produce stock as I see this strain has disappeared completely.
From all of the nl5xhaze seeds we sprouted I think if you had access to like 250-500 seeds you could get something very close but not identical, but maybe. Like I said they were similar but never the same.
I’ll report back when I have some seeds available to share and if you want some I’ll send them out.
 

#NightMare#

Well-known member
it just sounds like you're selling something. they say the best salesmen are true believers.

"There's a sucker born every minute"

everyone should have total confidence in anyone offering "lambsbreath" seed, it's a sure sign that they know what they're talking about.

let's play the numbers game! (attachment)

no one was growing haze in the 80's unless it was derived from Cultivators Choice/Sacred Seeds genetics (Dutch). "Sam" and his catalog claims that he only sold within Holland. if anyone else was growing haze from old seeds, they didn't know it as haze and had no nl access anyways.

the only likely explanation is that the cut was from seed obtained by mail in 87-89, my guess is a CSU student with 1000 watts, who retailed to other CSU students.

even in this millennium (the Trash Age) it was possible to get nlh phenos that smell like the old description attached but smoke like black pepper. as the fall 85 o haze catalog entry says: "10% are spectacular". which in my limited experience is a better rate than hazeless seed.

i've grown sativa nlh pheno (not mns sorry) with different males and had some females (not more than 25% of course) come out very close to the mother. some strains overpower the haze in every way, some don't.
Im sure this is one of nevils cuttings that blurb was based on.
unnamed.jpg

The nl/haze (mainly 5hz)was affectionately know as haze or nevil's haze by many people in the late 80's an early 90's, which is perhaps were some confusion stems from.
 
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dingo

Member
The nl/haze (mainly 5hz)was affectionately know as haze or nevil's haze by many people in the late 80's an early 90's, which is perhaps were some confusion stems from.
not in the US. maybe there was some confusion about Willem/William's Wonder. "Neville"'s Haze is not one of the hybrids sold in the 80's. seed sales to the US ended in 89 and did not start again for a long time.

that's Nevil's own catalog (87 or 88) saying nl#1.

haze is not Jamaican, with or without "Skunk", Jamaican isn't strong, and no one before the internet called Lamb's Bread anything else.
 

#NightMare#

Well-known member
not in the US. maybe there was some confusion about Willem/William's Wonder. "Neville"'s Haze is not one of the hybrids sold in the 80's. seed sales to the US ended in 89 and did not start again for a long time.

that's Nevil's own catalog (87 or 88) saying nl#1.

haze is not Jamaican, with or without "Skunk", Jamaican isn't strong, and no one before the internet called Lamb's Bread anything else.
I think you misunderstand, the nl5xhaze was called nevils haze or haze or Holland haze by alot of people (before the actual 5ac was named nevils haze.) 5ac was actually sold in the late 80's too but hadn't been named as nevils haze till much later.

I actually know a few people in the USA that had something passed to to them as Holland Haze or seedbank haze (which is were I think issfinxii's story is steming from an the confusion in it)what they thought to be straight haze, wich many years later were confirmed to be 5hz. I too think the cough is straight nl5haze from nevil.

I dont know about this Jamaican or lambsbread thing. I know that some people just used those tags (along whith thai, thai stick, Hawaiian, laos) despite nothing to do with those strains to try to hide the origin of the seeds they were using, mostly seedbank haze hybrids.

The picture I put up above is nl x haze, infact I think its nevils picture an I think is what the seedbank description you put up is the type the description was bassed on. Just thought it would be nice to put the actual strain an the description together.
 
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dingo

Member
I think you misunderstand, the nl5xhaze was called nevils haze or haze or Holland haze by alot of people (before the actual 5ac was named nevils haze.)
no i don't misunderstand, and, i was there. few heard of Nevil in the US before he went on the run from the DEA, and few heard of him even then (magazine readers mostly). his elevation to sainthood did not happen all at once. it wasn't like he was the only one selling seeds at the time, and it's strange to think that any and all nlh came from Nevil.

i'm sure that Neville's is from a later time, when exactly is probably mentioned in a thread on the subject somewhere.
from the official description on this site:
"A tribute to the father of all modern seed companies, Neville Schoenmakers...It was made by combining a pure Haze to a NL5/Haze"
 

#NightMare#

Well-known member
no i don't misunderstand, and, i was there. few heard of Nevil in the US before he went on the run from the DEA, and few heard of him even then (magazine readers mostly). his elevation to sainthood did not happen all at once. it wasn't like he was the only one selling seeds at the time, and it's strange to think that any and all nlh came from Nevil.

i'm sure that Neville's is from a later time, when exactly is probably mentioned in a thread on the subject somewhere.
from the official description on this site:
"A tribute to the father of all modern seed companies, Neville Schoenmakers...It was made by combining a pure Haze to a NL5/Haze"
Nevil made all his hybrids in primary form before any catalogs seed releases. Remember he got his pure hazes in 1984. In the 80's the 5ac (the later 1997 named nevils haze) was know as 5ac an also 3/4 haze .
There was also a map made with red dots, nevils nl5haze had flooded USA already. an buy the early 90's the USA was completely covered in these red dots. Shanti might stil have one of the pictures taken. Its pretty obvious were the cough comes from as to those who know it carries the traits of haze C which were easily identified an traits from nevils 5cut which only he had.
 
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Jahnova

MNS Award Winner
an also 3/4 haze
Not true. 75% Haze had Thai in it and was not the same as Nevil's Haze. It started to hermie after a few years 2/3rd in flowering and was discarded. I later grew it out from Franco who had it too somewhere early 2000's and the same happened, hermied really bad from week 11/12 of flowering.
 

#NightMare#

Well-known member
Not true. 75% Haze had Thai in it and was not the same as Nevil's Haze. It started to hermie after a few years 2/3rd in flowering and was discarded. I later grew it out from Franco who had it too somewhere early 2000's and the same happened, hermied really bad from week 11/12 of flowering.
Im not sure which haze your refering too, but im on about 5ac in particular. There were some earlier versions made of it before nevil perfected it early 90's. 5ac refers to 5axhzC aka nl5hzAxhzC. Here is the evidence it an many hybrids including many that never were made public or neither were put in the catalogue. Nevil used to keep 5ac as breeding plant. Some of the south holland guys hold one of the early versions of 5ac.
IMG_20220130_210916.png



This list was confirmed legit right here by nevil himself, I think he also corrected one or two mistakes on it. Its from 1986-1990 breedings. You'll also see the finished version aka 1997 nevils haze (5a(2a)xhzC) isnt on the list yet as it was made just after.
Im not sure what franco was given but nevil here did say 5ac was referred to as 3/4haze as well. I do know it was franco who reversed g13hz C and along with arjan they actually sold it as nevils haze. This is ghs nevils haze from one of the disc packs franco himself made. Those who know will clearly recognize it fir what it is, the old g13hz C. If franco knew it was g13hz an knowingly put it out as nevils haze or was genuinely mislead I dont know.
Ghs Neville's haze (actually g13haze C)20170221_094839.jpg
 
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Jahnova

MNS Award Winner
I'm just stating there was another cross called 75% Haze that was not Nevil's Haze. I actually never heard anyone use that term for Nevil's Haze before until i read it here. And the story behind that cross was it contained Thai. Took forever to flower, 16 to 18 weeks on rockwool. Tall, skinny buds, not a great yielder like most Nev phenos. I have seen only 1 pheno of this cross, the one i grew from the South was the exact same pheno Franco had.
 
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