1st time MNS, 1st time White Widow

[Grünhilde]

Hi all,

this is my first little report here.
I started growing 20 years ago, stopped for about 15 and started again in 2020.
The White Widow was (of course) always a school classic in my youth.
I did some research, found out that the MNS Black Widow should be the original and ordered some seeds in 2021.
It's always hard to decide which strain i want to grow next...
Finally, now is the time

I try to focus on one strain at a time (reg only mostly) and make some F2 seeds during the process.
So far so good, germination rate:
13 out of 18 (later, one died during the early veg).
I'm left with 12 BW plants right now.


12x Black Widow | Date: September 19, 2023

Some days ago, i transplanted them into 3,5 L pots.

12x Black Widow | Date: October 6, 2023

Btw, BW_A (plant hard left is a female - i found some hairs today!)
As you can see, 4 plants are a little bit laid back.

In the beginning i had some funny 3-way mutations going on.
I think on 3 BW plants, later it changed, but one (BW_B) still grows this way.

Black Widow seedling | Date: September 9, 2023


Black Widow_B 3-way | Date: October 6, 2023

I will try to update this thread on a regular basis.

Have a good one and cu soon!

 

[Diesel840]

Looks great so far. I'm subbed and eagerly watching.

 

[Swifty]

Welcome @Grünhilde, great start so far!
Will be watching also.

 

[Grünhilde]

Welcome @Swifty @Diesel840
Yesterday i did some cuttings.

Motherbox

23x Black Widow Cuttings | Date: October 14, 2023

Except for one plant i took always two cuttings.
I started to experiment with Aloe Vera a bit.
"Inserted" a piece of aloe vera into every cocos jiffy and plugged in the cutting afterwards.
Let's see how they perform this time.

Triangle

12x Black Widow | Date: October 14, 2023

Switched to 12/12 today.
And now less green images because i turned on the little high power LED expansions on the board.

Cu you soon

 

[Islandgrower]

Welcome @Swifty @Diesel840
Yesterday i did some cuttings.

Motherbox
View attachment 77361
23x Black Widow Cuttings | Date: October 14, 2023

Except for one plant i took always two cuttings.
I started to experiment with Aloe Vera a bit.
"Inserted" a piece of aloe vera into every cocos jiffy and plugged in the cutting afterwards.
Let's see how they perform this time.

Triangle
View attachment 77362
12x Black Widow | Date: October 14, 2023

Switched to 12/12 today.
And now less green images because i turned on the little high power LED expansions on the board.

Cu you soon

Your plants look happy . Good work can't wait to see the results in a few weeks.

 

[Ptree]

Hi, some pretty start !!
Seems like nice thread to watch

 

[musashi]

Looks like a good start so far.

mu

 

[Grünhilde]

Welcome @Ptree & @musashi,

thx for following my little project here.
Unfortunately i have allot of work around and can't update that often.

Right now they do a crazy stretch.
I was 2 nights not at home and when i came back 2 males grew into the lights and burned a bit.

Triangle (when i left on friday...)

12x Black Widow | Date: October 20, 2023

Triangle (when i came back on monday & growlights adjusted already...)

12x Black Widow | Date: October 23, 2023

Triangle Today

12x Black Widow | Date: October 25, 2023

BTW: 5 males & 7 girls
And just some background info:
No extra nutrients just water so far.
Old soil, just added some dolomite lime and little bit of worm castings.
I used poultry dung pellets in the past and had the feeling my old soil was a bit to acidly.
So far they don't lack anything i have the feeling.
Maybe still to much nutrients in the soil.
I measured the run off a few weeks ago and had a 2,4 something EC then.

In the next update i want to focus on the males.
I will introduce them to you in more detail in the coming days.

Cu soon!

 

[Diesel840]

@Grünhilde beautiful Widows. You have a good male/female ratio going so far.

I look forward to hearing about your males. Males are what I'm most anxious/interested in. I want a nice male but I've no experience yet with keeping them happy as Pop plants and selection.

Are you getting any discernable aromas yet from a stem rub?

 

[Grünhilde]

Here we go again,

yesterday i prepared all the males.
They keep stretching allot...

Triangle

12x Black Widow | Date: October 27, 2023

I took out every male, removed all the side branches and some of the leaves on top.
After that they got a "half open condom" on top.
This way i make sure they don't pollinate everything.
Its no 100% guarantee of course but worked well in the past.

BW_B

Black Widow_B male | Date: October 27, 2023

Was the 3-way guy, the smell is kind of sweet but not really intense
I would say he is solid and kind of special because of the mutation.
Good flower development so far.

BW_C

Black Widow_C male | Date: October 27, 2023

A special guy, very intense "Onion" aroma, flat stem mutation (even 3-way in the early days).
Nice flower development
One of my favorites!
Some more images of him:

Does anybody know how good or bad this flat stem mutation is for breeding?
The only time i had this in my growroom was with some Early Skunk (the one from Sensi, which i btw didn't like at all...).

BW_E

Black Widow_E male | Date: October 27, 2023

Smell is somehow "sour onion shit" but just if you really rub him.
Very stretchy guy, not really a fav of mine but lets see.

BW_F

Black Widow_F male | Date: October 27, 2023

This is another favorite of mine.
Strong aroma (sour), nice flower development, very healthy guy and no mutations so far.
He is the smallest of the guys.

 

[Grünhilde]

BW_G


Black Widow_G male | Date: October 27, 2023

Somewhat close to BW_F in a way but the aroma is more sweet onion.
Ok guy so far.
Here you can see the half open condom i was talking about

 

[Diesel840]

Does anybody know how good or bad this flat stem mutation is for breeding?

I'm not sure about the flat part, but I've read hollow stems may facilitate higher thc. I haven't the foggiest if this is true. If it is, it's probably facilitated by nutrients traveling in larger quantities or more easily up the stem. I wonder though, wouldn't a hollow stem more easily get air bubbles in the stem while taking a clone? DJ Short is a big believer in hollow stems facilitating more THC, but his genetics are notoriously difficult to clone. Could be a correlation between his breeding towards hollow stems and the difficulty associated with his genetics. Then again, I could be blowing proverbial smoke up everyone's cullo.
Diesel840

 

[Grünhilde]

good evening,

today just a short update (documentation)

Triangle

12x Black Widow | Date: October 30, 2023

The coming 3 days i‘m not at home.
I hope the ladies don’t stretch too much 'til my return.

The females a bit closer, flower development is really starting now


BW_A (female) & BW_B (male) in peaceful coexistance


Cu soon!

 

[Grünhilde]

I‘m back and all Widows survived

Triangle

12x Black Widow | Date: November 3, 2023

Females update


BW_A (female) & BW_B (male) in peaceful coexistance updated


Tomorrow, the females will move into my mainflowertent.
Have to harvest some plants first…

In the coming days i’ll pollinate the lower braches and kill the males i won’t use.
As mentioned earlier my plan is to focus on two males.

have a nice weekend!

 

[Grünhilde]

Just a short sunday update,

yesterday all the girls moved in their new home.
More space, better LED and a raspberry pi HD cam watching over them.

Raspcam

7x Black Widow - Mr. Nice Seeds, 1x Limon Blanco V2 - Khalifa Genetics | Date: November 5, 2023

This mutation on that widow in the center, how do you call that?
I had this already in the past but it kind of "grew out" most of the time.
Maybe a soil issue (i always use the same...).
Btw, still just watering without any nutrients added.
Even on the Limon Blanco just water since the very beginning (only difference is the 9 L pot)

I recognized i never mentioned the flowering times.
This might be useful so

Flowering times (12/12):
Black Widow day 22
Limon Blanco day 59

cu soon!

 

[sneakyfeck]

Just a short sunday update,

yesterday all the girls moved in their new home.
More space, better LED and a raspberry pi HD cam watching over them.

Raspcam
View attachment 78083
7x Black Widow - Mr. Nice Seeds, 1x Limon Blanco V2 - Khalifa Genetics | Date: November 5, 2023

This mutation on that widow in the center, how do you call that?
I had this already in the past but it kind of "grew out" most of the time.
Maybe a soil issue (i always use the same...).
Btw, still just watering without any nutrients added.
Even on the Limon Blanco just water since the very beginning (only difference is the 9 L pot)

I recognized i never mentioned the flowering times.
This might be useful so

Flowering times (12/12):
Black Widow day 22
Limon Blanco day 59

cu soon!

looks a bit like tobacco mosaic virus to me. But i could definitely be wrong

Tobacco Mosaic Virus (TMV) Symptoms & Treatment on Cannabis

Tobacco mosaic virus causes strange mottling symptoms in the leaves, slow growth and reduced yields. Learn how to identify and treat TMV for good!

www.growweedeasy.com

 

[Swifty]

This mutation on that widow in the center, how do you call that?
I had this already in the past but it kind of "grew out" most of the time.

I believe that this is called variegation, its a mutation that pops up from time to time.
You can find info here on the site.

Nice plants!

 

[Grünhilde]

tobacco mosaic virus to me

that was what i was afraid of in the beginning, but after some reading about it i'm not even sure if cannabis really can get it.
And the other thing is i had similar mutations on at least five of the widows in the beginning.

this is called variegation, its

so i think and hope it might be this
Right now i have other problems...

I was so happy about the males and how they smelled so far.
Yesterday i wanted to pollinate the females...
Guess what, 4 out of 5 males showed hermaphrodite traits.

Black Widow hermie male flowers on November 7, 2023 (flowering day 24)






The good thing is that at least one male seems to be the fine and i didn't find any herm on the females so far.
Sad is that f.e. BW_E and some others showed already some resin on the top leaves.
Thats a trait which is usually harder to find on males...
BW_C & F produced really allot of flowers and the smell was very intense.

BW_G, the only clean guy is not the biggest producer lets say.
Smaller and tiny flowers, the aroma is kind of onion but less compared to f.e. C and F.

What do you think about the situation?
Any experience with widow males and herms?
The seeds would be fems i guess?

I thought the widow males are winners
Maybe they didn't like my treatment, but at the same time its not the first time i did this.
I keep watching BW_G in the coming days/weeks.
If he stays straight forward I'm happy.

keep you updated about the situation!
have a nice evening

 

[Islandgrower]

that was what i was afraid of in the beginning, but after some reading about it i'm not even sure if cannabis really can get it.
And the other thing is i had similar mutations on at least five of the widows in the beginning.

so i think and hope it might be this
Right now i have other problems...

I was so happy about the males and how they smelled so far.
Yesterday i wanted to pollinate the females...
Guess what, 4 out of 5 males showed hermaphrodite traits.

Black Widow hermie male flowers on November 7, 2023 (flowering day 24)
View attachment 78185
View attachment 78186
View attachment 78187
View attachment 78188
View attachment 78189

The good thing is that at least one male seems to be the fine and i didn't find any herm on the females so far.
Sad is that f.e. BW_E and some others showed already some resin on the top leaves.
Thats a trait which is usually harder to find on males...
BW_C & F produced really allot of flowers and the smell was very intense.

BW_G, the only clean guy is not the biggest producer lets say.
Smaller and tiny flowers, the aroma is kind of onion but less compared to f.e. C and F.

What do you think about the situation?
Any experience with widow males and herms?
The seeds would be fems i guess?

I thought the widow males are winners
Maybe they didn't like my treatment, but at the same time its not the first time i did this.
I keep watching BW_G in the coming days/weeks.
If he stays straight forward I'm happy.

keep you updated about the situation!
have a nice evening

Interesting that most show hermaphrodite tendencies. Not sure if it will produce fem seeds though. Not a trait I would want too pass on it may make females do the same thing. Would be interesting to see what would happen if used as pollen donor.

 

[Diesel840]

I thought the widow males are winners
Maybe they didn't like my treatment, but at the same time its not the first time i did this.
I keep watching BW_G in the coming days/weeks.
If he stays straight forward I'm happy.

Any potential light leaks, unbalanced ph, vpd off, over fed, accidental bumps to the timer, overly rootbound?

I've seen very few reports of Black Widow hermying. It happens though, like all varieties.

You could always run those males again and see if they herm again.