Mark's Angel's Breath - New Year's Haze

Marcus_in_the_Darkus

Well-known member
Hello MNS friends. I'm really excited to start my third grow, my first haze hybrid and my first MNS strain. I've collected a number of MNS strains, and my focus has been almost exclusively on haze hybrids. Other candidates for my first MNS grow included Afghan Haze, Mango Haze inbred line, Neville's Haze Mango and Super Silver Widow. I decided on Angel's Breathe because the parents are so well regarded and because the few reviews have been enticing, to say the least. Nevil commented that AB looks like a great strain. Also, because there aren't many (or any?) complete Angel's Breathe grow logs here, I figured that perhaps I could make a positive contribution to the community.

A bit about me and my setup: I'm a legal, personal rec grower in Massachusetts, a scientist, a tinkerer and an energy efficiency nut. Needless to say I grow under COBs, two 300W 6-Citizen CLU048 COB fixtures I designed and built for 600 W of light in the flowering tent. My 4x4 tent recently turned into a flowering tent when I built a veg/clone cabinet, in which I'll grow and clone the AB seedlings. The veg/clone cabinet is functional but incomplete, and I'll post up some pics of that along the way. I really love growing and having the veg/clone cabinet allows me to do more of it in a given time span. I'm also interested in automation and will be working on that as time allows.

My tent is in my unheated basement so growing in winter is painful because I spend more electricity on supplemental heat than I do on the lights. So I hope to do some things to maximize the overall energy efficiency of my setup, with an emphasis on HVAC efficiency as much as COB LEDs. I'm currently flowering Strawberry Cough and Tangie and I unwittingly timed my current grow well because this (mid August) is the time of year when humidity and temps in the tent can get high (as much as 86F and 75%), but as the outside weather turns cooler that should be less of an issue late in flower. Current grow is at F25-F33, so I expect the flower tent to be available in October. I hope to have a few nice plants harvested around the new year, hence the title of this grow log. :)

My plan is to grow out up to 10 plants from seed, take clones, and flower the clones in October. I'm growing in coco hempy buckets and using the General Hydroponics flora series drain-to-waste (DTW) feed schedule:



I built a drain table with a 15-gal reservoir below, so my tent only has about 52 inches (1.3 m ) of headroom between the coco surface and the COB fixtures. I'm therefore a little nervous about controlling the height of these plants during the stretch, based on what Shanti said, but I now have some experience mainlining and I'm ready to take on the challenge. :D

it is a strain needing some experience with Hazes....but when it comes out right you will be most satisfied...I assure you.
So, I popped a half tube (10) of Angel's Breathe seeds today in rapid rooters, and we're off!

 
Last edited:

masey

Member
Good luck marcus, I'll be keeping a close eye on this one - cyoheights left some good information on finding his particular pheno if that's what you are looking for. I'm saving my AB until i'm outdoors again myself. Totally agree AB could do with a few more reports.
 
Last edited:

Byorn

Active member
greetings marcus_in_the_darkus!

Nice to see you start this grow with the AngelBreath. I think its a great contribution to the forum, especially if you finish it. Hoping everyday more people will do this, even if the grow turns bad, there is always something to learn from it.
i am jealous about you being able to grow legal! still cant convince the wife of moving to a legal state.

Nice light setup!! you are right about those high humidity in this time of the year. 69% here as we speak and already lost some to bud rot.

how about scrog?

how and what are you going to automate ? is there an arduino involved? I have a arduino checking my COB temperatures, and the amps from the drivers. if something is out of range it will shut down the hole light system and switch on the emergency lamp and notice me by sms that there is a problem.

anyway, cool strain! i will follow. Wish you all the best and luck with the grow!

GoOd Day!
 

Marcus_in_the_Darkus

Well-known member
After 72 hours, AB#10 has popped, three more are shedding their husks and most of the rest are showing activity in their rapid rooters but not yet above "ground." I just won another pack of AB on the auctions so I have plenty to pop a few more if all 10 seeds don't germinate.

@masey - That's the pheno I'm looking for! He wrote a fantastic description in the flavor profiles thread. I'm sure I'll find something nice. :)

@Byorn - It is nice to grow legally and not be looking over your shoulder all the time. Makes it easier to enjoy those racy sativas! I share your frustration reading long grow logs that never get finished, or with no smoke report. After all, I think the affect is what most of us are after. I plan to finish this one in early 2018! I like to be able to move my plants around so I'm not a fan of SCROG, and I realize I'm probably leaving yield on the table by not doing SCROG, but I'll consider it for this grow. I'm planning on lots of topping and training either way. Regarding automation, I have bought a bunch of Arduino sensors and stuff, but have not had time yet to get past the "blinking LED" part of the learning curve. The computer language I'm most experienced with is FORTRAN, lol, so we'll see if this old dog can be taught new tricks. The first things I want to do are to datalog temp and RH in my tent, in my veg/clone cabinet and in my basement. Then I'd like to get rid of the multiple timers I have and use this LinkNode R4: WiFi relay controller 4-Channel Relay Module I recently bought to run four lights: (1) 600 W COBs in my flower tent, (2) 12 W far red LED in my flower tent, (3) 190 W T8 fluoros in my veg/clone cabinet, and (4) future flower space in the veg cabinet. If I can get that figured out then I have an idea for a 4" 12VDC blower motor controlled based on temp and humidity inside the tent and outside in air. I think there's more energy to be saved in HVAC than in lighting for most grow setups!

@OGL1 - No outdoor plants right now other than a male I'm using to collect pollen. I popped four Tangie seeds in May and tried vegging them outdoors this spring and early summer and they performed terribly because we had a cold wet spring and because they were only getting full sun after 10:30 am. They were very happy to be moved into the tent when room became available (6 of 9 indoor Strawberry Cough plants were male). I have very little outdoor weed growing experience but did actually grow some Mexican bagseed into 10' monsters in 1975. :D
 
Last edited:

masey

Member
:D Simone must be thinking blimey why is Angel B so popular all of sudden, she has cyoheights to thank!
 

Marcus_in_the_Darkus

Well-known member
Hello all. I am happy to report that 9 of the 10 seeds are up and the 10th is still in play wearing a seed helmet a little below the Rapid Rooter surface. I tried to upload a picture but get an "upload failed" message in the "Manage Attachments" window. It's a 228 KB jpg file. No problems using this method on my first post. Any suggestions?

@masey, cyoheights' description is indeed fantastic, but it begs the question why is he running SSH when he's found the female Viagra pheno of Angel's Breathe? :confused: I think it's fair to say there's some embellishment in his post :D but, regardless, it's still worth it to pheno hunt through this strain, considering the plants both its parents have produced.

@Dogdaze, thanks for stopping by. I'm really psyched to see how this grow unfolds, and will appreciate input from all.
 
I grew out some AB, and the one i kept is still worth keeping.
it has a very sweet mango type smell, not very "hazey" but its nice.

i recently ran through a few skunk x hazes and found a very similar plant.
im not going to keep it just because the AB already fills that slot.
 

Marcus_in_the_Darkus

Well-known member
Since I still am not having success uploading attachments here, I started another diary elsewhere on the net and will link images from there until the MNS crew returns from holiday and we can get the image uploading problem sorted out. Given the recent Photobucket debacle that left a gaping hole in the internet, there's a lot of value to users from websites like MNS that host images natively; the content also increases the value of those websites. Nuff said about that. This is a dope-growing thread, not a techie thread. :D On edit - I forgot that the workaround to the image hosting problem is to create an album and use that link to insert an image. Problem resolved.
Thanks Byorn! :)


These seedlings took a while to germinate, and after about 5 days I decided to help the stragglers (#2, #5, #8) along with the old embryonic-membrane-removal-with-tweezers trick. Still a 90% germination rate is pretty good, and #2 is still in play so it could be 100%. I used tap water (100 ppm, pH 7 here) for the first 5 days then added a few drops of RapidStart. I'll transfer the seedlings to 6" square pots with coco coir in a few days. They are in my cabinet under ~190W of T8 fluoros from 7pm-11am, but these last bright sunny days I've let them soak up some of Sol's goodness.



Couple questions for the experienced growers here:

  • I noticed a fine layer of grayish mold or mildew on the surface of the Rapid Rooters when I took them out of my under-ventilated veg/clone cabinet yesterday and put them under the sun. They say sunlight is the best disinfectant, and the stuff went right away. Is this a concern as they go back into the veg cabinet? I have not yet installed a vent system in the cabinet and am just leaving the front panel open for now.
  • Can this first set of leaves give any indication of narrow/broad-leaf phenotype? These mostly look pretty skinny to me but it may be my imagination.

Thanks for following along.
 
Last edited:

Byorn

Active member
hey marcus!

Yeah it takes some time to get used to the arduino language. Im not a programmer of sorts so i never heard of FORTRAN only know some javascripting as well. with some basic electrical knowledge you can get most things done quite easily. Theres a lot of info and projects online where i learned my way with it. even saw growroom projects that where very cool and informative to get ideas from. Next thing i want to build is an sunrise fader for the cob drivers.

Seems like a nice relay board, very decent.


nice to have 100% germination rate! hope you will get the picture thing fixed. I do trough putting picture up into an album and than copy the link to my topic.

cant wait to see some pics :)

greetings!!
 

musashi

Site Moderator
Staff member
An excellent variety with reasonable grow time. Smells from afghan funk to mango sweet. Thick spice, leather, and incense. Smooth smoke with menthol, mango, metal, other unique and indescribable flavors. Aggressive growth when switched waiting until the last moment for full expression. Good yields with colas reminding me of SSH. I personally experienced some herms so be mindful when growing concurrently with your proven stuff. A great hybrid bringing some pain relief. Alas no sexual response as mentioned in Cyto's post. I'm guessin that comes from the AH side as I find Afghan does that to many. A little heavy at times for me so great for late afternoon and evenings. For me, The Cure edges it out for pain with a little less lethargy which occurs several hrs later with the AB. AB is definitely in the top ten for me. Personal preference is what it's all about and if push comes to shove and I had to count on one hand; I still reach for Nevilles, Nevilles Mango, Mango Haze.

Cool runnin braddahs
M
 
Last edited:

Marcus_in_the_Darkus

Well-known member
Hello MNS friends! 100% germination! I transplanted all Rapid Rooters to 6" pots with coco and am feeding them light nutes (200 ppm 2M/1G/1B +CaMg) mixed from DI (dehumidifier) water. They seem to be happy, even though 2 of 3 of my T8 fixtures randomly turn themselves off. I'm tired of these cheap-ass lights and am replacing them with 4' LED shop light fixtures this week. AB #10 had the most vigorous roots (probably a male) and #5 seems to have the best proto-trichome coverage, but nothing else noteworthy at this point. Here's a pic I snapped this morning.



@jack hairy I appreciate your comments. When you said not very "hazey," you were referring to the smell, right? How would you describe the effect of the AB plants you grew and of your keeper?

@Byorn I love the idea of a sunrise/sunset timer for the COBs. I'll be interested to see what you come up with and I'd also like to be able to start dimming the lights at an upper setpoint temperature, as I've exceeded 90F a few times this summer, even in my basement. Temps would've been a lot worse off with HPS though, so COBs to the rescue again! I designed my lights with panel-mounted LED drivers to keep as much heat out of the tent as possible. They do radiate a fair amount of heat at 600W.

@musashi thanks for your observations. I enjoy reading your posts here at MNS, and I value your opinion especially about aromas and effects. Lethargy and a little heavy are not particularly what I'm after, but I would expect some real haze-leaning-effect phenos, if not in this batch then certainly in the F2s, which I hope to be able to produce. Based on your comments, I wonder what Shanti's selection criteria were for the AfHz male that fathers these plants, perhaps it leans more Afghan in effect than I would've hoped.

Thanks all for following along. I appreciate your input and I'll try not to bore you with too many veg pics. :)
 
Last edited:

Marcus_in_the_Darkus

Well-known member
Three weeks have passed since I planted these seeds. Most of them are doing OK. All of them have sufferred from too little light, as 2/3 of my fluoro fixtures were essentially inoperable, so I upgraded to LED shoplights as discussed in my veg cabinet thread. They seem to be responding well, but I'm afraid I'm not going to have any clones ready in October, at least not early October.

Three of the seedlings have issues, and I think I must've screwed up by transplanting some of the seedlings into coco that I reused without flushing, so they almost OD'd on flower nutes. The cotyledon leaves on these three shriveled up, the seedlings were dark green, I saw a little nute burn, etc. When I realized my mistake I flushed them and have been feeding light nutes since. Two of these runts, #2 and #5, were also quite late to germinate and needed some help. If I were selecting for vigor I'd cull them but runts seem to have a reputation for bringing recessive traits to the fore, so let's see what happens with them.



 

Marcus_in_the_Darkus

Well-known member
Hello MNS friends,

It is now almost 6 weeks since I popped a half straw of Angel's Breathe seeds. Since the last update I learned that I was seriously underfeeding them until about a couple weeks ago when I upped the nutes to exactly what the GH feed chart calls for at mid veg stage. The plants responded well but some are still showing signs of their earlier underfeeding. I have learned through this that AB6 was the least sensitive to underfeeding and AB8 was most sensitive. So I'm watching AB6 now and diluting it's feed a little bit. The two runts (AB2 and AB5) remain while the other runt AB3 is looking more like its siblings and no longer deserves the moniker. So that plants are overall doing OK. Here's a shot of AB1-AB5 before I took clones, followed by a shot of AB6-AB10 before clones were taken.





So I topped all plants last night at the 3rd or 4th node (most had 6-7 nodes) except the runts, and put the tops in a bubble cloner I just made. When I looked at the clones tonight they look horrible, all wilted. Is it normal for cuttings to look this crappy after one day? I think I had the dome on too tight (not enough airflow) and it may have gotten fairly warm inside the cloner, because it's pretty close to the light. So I moved the bubble cloner down to the bottom of the cabinet and propped the dome open about an inch.
Hopefully they make it.



I decided to go ahead and start flowering the two runts, AB2 and AB5, because I only have a couple plants left in flower for my current grow, so there's room available. I'll try to get a cutting of each as they stretch but before they get too far into flower. Here they are under the COBs.



And here are the remaining 8 plants still in veg after I topped them. I'm trying to figure out how to manage these plants. They're almost big enough for me to take more cuttings, but I'm wondering if the clones don't take maybe I should start mainlining these so I could flower the seedplants instead of clones. Problem is I'm looking at about another 3-4 weeks of veg if I mainline them.



Comments and suggestions are welcome. :)
 
Last edited:

Marcus_in_the_Darkus

Well-known member
The Angel's Breathe cuttings are looking better after a day and a half in the bubble cloner. I added more water to the cloner because I'm not sure if the cutting tips were getting enough water; now the bubbles are popping at the surface right below the tips and they are getting lots of fine mist as they should. Four have perked up, and the other three appear to be improving.



I have a question about the health of these clones. The tips of the cuttings appear to have shrunk in the area where I applied cloning gel. I'm not sure if this is normal and I should just wait for them to root or if I should re-cut and reapply gel to these tips. Any suggestions?



I've read that cloning from topped plants, as I have done here, is more difficult than cloning from lower branches. Fortunately, if these clones don't work out I have plenty of new cuttings I can take from my seedplants, I'll just lose a little time waiting for the clones to root. The main thing I'm going to have to deal with soon is to figure out how to keep my seedplants to a manageable size through the grow. I'm going to go back and read up on the Bonsai Mother pictorial thread.
 

hesh

New member
Hey Marcus, lookin' good so far. I've got some AB on the way, excited to see how yours turn out.

I started using an EZ cloner a couple months ago. They state that it's not necessary to use a dome with this method, so if you've got your pH adjusted correctly, then perhaps you could try leaving the dome off and see if they perk up some more. I usually take off or trim big fans as well. Some cuttings end up with necrotic or degenerative effects on the bottom of the stem like the one in your post, generally those did not make it. Seems to happen more with tiny stalks than with thicker stemmed cuttings. After some initial success, the EZ cloner system ended up being a huge PITA and I lost a couple cuts despite my best efforts to regularly clean, replace and pH'd water (+ clear rez) with humid/temps in proper range, so I'm now back to using the regular old peat puck and clone dome method I've used for 10 years with no more issues. Hopefully you'll have better success than I did! :D
 

OGL1

Member
Marcus I would recommend recutting those above the shrunken area. I've never used a bubble cloner but that don't look right.
 
ive used clone machies for a long time and when they are set up right they can usually provide 100% success.
ive never used a dome with one.
water temps need to be kept under control. if its getting too warm,you will have problems.
although i do prefer ez clone type sprayers to the bubble cloners, i have used both.
i have seen stems shrink like that before, and its not really a good sign. i would recut any that look like that and get them back in the machine. i have seen roots come off the stem above the shrunken area. ive cut away the mushy stem end before planting.
ive been having good success using dyna grow gel, clonex liquid in the water, and about an ounce per gallon h202. i try to start off clean and sanitized by using h202 after initial cleaning.
good luck
maybe ill try and get a pic of the AB i kept, she usually goes about 75-80, very sweet mango type flavor with nice resin and nice sized buds.
 
Top